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Charles Fischer

In 2022...Do Cheerleader Photos Inspire or Offend?

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What are your views about cheerleader photos returning to FishDuck.com? Should they or not, and why?  (I especially would like to hear from the female readers)

 

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FISHDUCK.COM

I am not looking to start a discussion that could go political, nor do I wish to offend anyone on either side of this issue. However we implemented a ban on...

 

Mr. FishDuck

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I love beautiful. Especially when the insides match the outsides (rare). I like to watch others dance and sing. I like seeing people smile. 

 

Cheerleaders are men and women who participate in the game experience. They are having fun. Good times. 

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I just got back from Hawaii, pictures of the young lady's on the beach would be inappropriate for most on Fishduck. I think the outfits most young people wear now don't fit into what we are used to. I think it is just a generational thing, and no I don't have any pictures to post!

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While I think it's true that some will objectify them, they knowingly risk that. Photos (and cheerleaders in general) don't offend me, and they really are beautiful and add to the game day experience.  I think the point could be made that it's sexist by including or even excluding them. In the end this is your barbeque and I won't be offended either way...

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Funny that it is even a question. With all the issues in the world this doesn't seem to be a big problem. That said, no real reason to include cheerleader pictures as this is more of a site to talk about football and if somebody wants to check out the cheerleaders there are probably plenty of other options.

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My daughter was a cheerleader for 4 years during the Bellotti years.  My wife and I supported her time at Oregon.

 

Cheerleaders spend many hours practicing and work very hard!  In addition to pregame activities and games they participate in fundraising events, work at golf tournaments, and countless hours at bowl games.

 

I agree that new outfits (Nike designed) and dance routines are a generational thing.  Including them in pictures of football is ok with me!

 

 

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We are all so super sensitive to so many things now... and worried about getting "called out" on it on social media.... for what seems like a small percentage of people over reacting to anyone and anything.

 

Why should anyone worry about cheerleader photos when...

 

- onlyfans is a thing now. this is just a private way to pay to 'stare'...

 

- being an 'influencer' on social media is a full time, high paying job now. Most of these are scantily clad women who make huge money of this...

 

- people still support both women and men (or any "sex" in between) when they are barely clothed for many reasons.

 

I think anything can be done in a tasteful and respectful manner. 

 

So can cheerleader photos.

 

Cheers!

 

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They’re part of the team. Just like the band, trainers, equipment folks, etc. They all influence the game and fan experience.

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I believe the answer is contained in one sentence of the editorial.

 

"So much depends upon the actual photo…as some cross the line, while others are benign and symbolize the celebration that is being an Oregon Duck."

 

I’m not sure there’s relevance in posting pictures solely of young ladies clothed in not much more than beach apparel, and I can’t believe I just typed that.  In today's "I'm offended" environment, photos of that nature open to door to questions and criticism.   

 

Now, I do see significance to having cheerleaders in photos that help convey emotion during a moment of the game.  Running onto the field, post-score reactions, brief interactions with fans and mascots, and sadly, even tears from heart-breaking losses can be elicit an emotion and are worthy of being captured by camera.

 

Me personally - not offended, but I can't even begin to quantify the percentages of people that stand on either side of this discussion.  In this scenario playing it safe (right or wrong) seems to be the way to go.   

 

Slightly off topic, but I want to get this out there. 

 

Yelling, screaming, clapping fans coupled with the sideline visual of waving pom-poms and dance teams heighten our viewing experience and simply add to the greatness that can only be seen in college football.  When the UO support team (cheerleaders, etc.) take the field it enhances an already revved-up environment.  You not only will have to deal with a football team ready to kick your a**, but now you’re going to witness support in numbers you haven’t seen.  Support that’s going to push this crowd to edge and beyond.  You look in the stands – all you see is green and yellow.  Your focus your eyeballs to the field and sidelines hoping to find a respite from what’s going on around you but to your chagrin all you find is Oregon’s support teams gaining momentum and enthusiasm as you find that yours is waning with each passing minute. 

 

You’re in Autzen, baby.  You have a front row seat to your own private hell for the next couple of hours.  Do you now understand now why teams don’t want to play here?  Come on, we know the answer. 

 

I’ve been referencing all those athletes other than the Oregon football team as “support team”.  I think they are fabulous, and an integral part of what makes the Oregon football experience special. 

 

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I also think it comes down to showing fans enthusiastically cheering for their Ducks is awesome. Showing a cheerleader man, or women cheering for their Ducks is very appropriate.

 

The cheerleaders also do moves which can put them in compromising positions when caught in static photos. Showing photos which highlight positions which are suppose to be dynamic moves, and inspire shouldn't be shown. That is ok and inspirational at the game, and if there is a particularly amazing move the cheerleaders are doing show the video.

 

I would add these cheerleaders work hard at their craft. Showing videos and pictures shows respect for what they work extremely hard at, when done respectfully.

 

I think we can also find fans in the stands in compromising positions and in outfits of poor taste. Just keep it at photos showing enthusiasm without the compromising positions. 

 

This is a fan site, show fans, cheerleaders and supporters exhibiting, revealing their love of the Ducks, and nothing else.

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First off, it’s not about being "offended" and we ALL (liberal and conservative) have topics that bother us. If that wasn't  the case we wouldn’t have a ban on politics.

 

It’s about respecting other people as people, not as objects of contempt, scorn, (with exceptions for USC and Washington sports), or lust. I don’t have any issues of photographs of cheerleaders rooting for the Ducks, (which is the main purpose of this site) but don’t want to see salacious photos of male or female cheerleaders. 

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The famous line, you know it when you see it.  Pictures can be subjective, but I feel like we have a good group of people here who wouldn't put up what the majority of people would consider inappropriate.  At my office, we have the 80/20 rule for work flow.  We know we aren't going to make everybody happy, so if we get 80% we move forward.

 

Not offended with appropriate cheerleader photos.

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On 8/4/2022 at 10:57 AM, lownslowav8r said:

It’s about respecting other people as people, not as objects of contempt, scorn, (with exceptions for USC and Washington sports), or lust. I don’t have any issues of photographs of cheerleaders rooting for the Ducks, (which is the main purpose of this site) but don’t want to see salacious photos of male or female cheerleaders.

I am in agreement. Cheerleading is part of the game experience and as long as photos are appropriate, I don't see any problem. 

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I am not interested in seeing pictures of cheerleaders. I don't watch them at games, haven't for years. They pretty much stopped leading cheers years ago when they started doing bump-and-grind dance routines instead. 

 

To each his or her own, but I have no interest in seeing photos of cheerleaders on FishDuck.

Edited by Annie
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People have posted some great points and when we post something this is “our personal” opinion. We all have them and I appreciate it.

 

This is Mr Fischer’s site and it’s his call on what is or isn’t posted (Photos and words). We all have the choice to leave if we don’t agree, but sounds like we may be going with majority rules… I can live with that.

 

Personally I’m indifferent.

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On 8/4/2022 at 5:30 AM, Wrathis said:

In the end this is your barbeque and I won't be offended either way...

You are very kind, but as an old-fart, I am trying to navigate this difficult new world of what is correct.  And no, I do not want to get into a discussion about "woke-ness," but simply stating that it is harder these days to not offend.

Mr. FishDuck

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On 8/4/2022 at 8:40 AM, Charles Fischer said:

You are very kind, but as an old-fart, I am trying to navigate this difficult new world of what is correct.  And no, I do not want to get into a discussion about "woke-ness," but simply stating that it is harder these days to not offend.

If you try to please everyone, not offend, you know what happens, right. I won't post the answer as there are plentiful quotes to reference.

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“You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time”

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 The answer is inspire. A home game is a great atmosphere and our young men and women on the cheer squad help bring that out with the great job they do to enrich the experience  before and during the game.

 

 Heck, I married 2 cheerleaders, one for 47 years, and it was something they both loved to do.

 

 My Grandaughter is a high school cheer leader and a model and wants to do the same next year in college. She just had a photo shoot that took most of the day with over 1000 shots and she loved it. Her face was a little numb from smiling all day however.😁

 

 Don’t think any of these girls give or gave much of a thought about being photographed in awkward positions. It’s all part of it.

 

 If the girls don’t mind then I certainly don’t, it’s part of the experience. 

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On 8/4/2022 at 5:32 AM, LADuck said:

no real reason to include cheerleader pictures as this is more of a site to talk about football

We used to have cheerleader photos often, because as a writer...inserting pictures is harder than you would think.  (And nobody gives it a thought except for the writers who are trying to figure out what to populate their article with) Sometimes you just need a photo to break up all the paragraphs of text, but anything general about the Ducks, such as a category I call, "gameday atmosphere" which is where the cheerleader pictures fit.

 

The cheerleaders are part of the Oregon Brand, and adding pictures of them adds to a "football atmosphere" in an article.  That is why we used them...

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Mr. FishDuck

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Some people want to infer the most negative about any scenario.  Others see the glass as half full or better.  For better or worse (bump and grind etc) it's part of the game day experience.  Leading cheers has changed over the years.  One year at Stanford they had a particularly fun cheer as after a bad Oregon play the Stanford cheer team came up with "The Ducks have lost their down".......or from the 50s "harass them, harass them, make them relinquish the ball"

Boy how things have changed.

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On 8/4/2022 at 7:25 AM, Haywarduck said:

Just keep it at photos showing enthusiasm without the compromising positions. 

It is harder than you would think.  One time, years ago I called one of our photographers that had been at an Oregon basketball game shooting pictures for us.  I told him, "there is a stretch of pictures that I cannot possibly use!"  "What were you doing taking those pictures and sending them along?"

 

He responded with, "if they are going to stick their butts out in front of my face....I'm shooting them!"

 

After we both howled with laughter did I realize that in a way...it was his rebellion to the overabundance of over-the-top suggestive dance moves.  Point made!  (And no, not only did we not use them...I deleted them so as to not even allow writers the option to use them!)

Mr. FishDuck

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On 8/4/2022 at 8:58 AM, Charles Fischer said:

It is harder than you would think.  One time, years ago I called one of our photographers that had been at an Oregon basketball game shooting pictures for us.  I told him, "there is a stretch of pictures that I cannot possibly use!"  "What were you doing taking those pictures and sending them along?"

 

He responded with, "if they are going to stick their butts out in front of my face....I'm shooting them!"

 

After we both howled with laughter did I realize that in a way...it was his rebellion to the overabundance of over-the-top suggestive dance moves.  Point made!  (And no, not only did we not use them...I deleted them so as to not even allow writers the option to use them!)

You should have been on the beach and out in the lineup to surf. The amount of butt exposed in these times is asstounding!

 

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On 8/4/2022 at 8:46 AM, Charles Fischer said:

The cheerleaders are part of the Oregon Brand,

They are indeed, and also physically gifted. A cheerleader can be standing still and then just decide to do a complete backflip!!! That's amazing, and then when the male cheerleader is holding the female cheerleader up in the air, holding onto her feet? The strength and agility each are demonstrating in that "simple" cheer maneuver is nothing short of amazing. 

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On 8/4/2022 at 8:45 AM, Just Ducky said:

 

 Don’t think any of these girls give or gave much of a thought about being photographed in awkward positions. It’s all part of it.

 

 If the girls don’t mind then I certainly don’t, it’s part of the experience. 

You know...I am embarrassed to write that I did not even consider of what the young women and men who "cheer" think about it. Since they are out there doing it, I imagine they would like the additional coverage and exposure (a pun!) to their work.  In the end, while they probably don't feel objectified--the decision process for me is all about the good people of this community...which is why I am asking.

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Mr. FishDuck

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Since i am no longer married I say bring it on. There was a day when I would have to pass on that.🥲

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the Only photo of a member of the cheer squad that offended me was ROBO duck. I’ve been trying to unsee that for years.

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IMHO, as long as the pictures themselves are reasonable (e.g. not revealing cleavage shots), if anyone is truly offended by seeing pictures of women who choose to work hard to be on the sidelines of every game, encouraged by the university, then those readers have the right to be offended and not read that article, or not use this site - the same way any of us can depart if we're offended that you won't allow posts about religion or politics.

 

Cheerleading is hard.  At the high school level, according to the National Center for Catastrophic Sports Injury Research, cheerleading has the highest rate of catastrophic injuries of any sport or activity - more catastrophic injuries per 100,000 participants than football or hockey. A high school cheerleader has a chance of catastrophic injury that is 35 times higher than a high school basketball player.  So these are far more than pretty girls in skimpy outfits - they are female athletes (not to mention the males who participate as well).  Maybe they're not working at an activity some of us particularly value, but that doesn't minimize the risks they take or they work they put in to be there.

 

As such, how is seeing pictures of cheerleaders any different from seeing pictures of a beach volleyball team or a swim team?  Or sometimes even a tennis team?  Competitive swimsuits for both male and female athletes leave far less to the imagination than do most cheerleading outfits.

 

If you decide not to have cheerleaders on the site, I won't be offended.  But they are part of the game, the same way the stadium, fans, the opponent, referees, players, injuries, and coaches are part of the game.  So incorporating some shots of cheerleaders is, to me, a perfectly natural part of the game.  As such, it is perfectly natural to have them on the site.

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Posted (edited)

     How cheerleaders are responded to in the modern age is as diverse as the fan base to which they are trying to appeal.
 

     In it’s origins, cheerleading was a male-only occupation, and directed solely at an in-person audience composed almost entirely of the student body and alumni: directors to their choir, preachers to their congregation. They were there for only one reason: to initiate the call and response (including card sections) that urged the faithful on to inspire their team. If you’ve ever listen to some ancient stadium tapes, you can really hear that unity of purpose.

 

     If you review similarly ancient student newspapers from any university of the time, the introduction of females to the art of cheerleading was pretty much viewed with the same shock that the idea of legalizing marijuana once incurred. It was the fear of redirecting the attention of the audience towards an object of desire, and away from the original purpose of cheering the team.

 

     I guess you could either call it a self-fulfilling prophecy, or just the natural path that social inclusion generally takes. Either way, when you add modern media to the mix, you’ve got the potential for the full range of human response to whatever one may desire to watch.  Deal with it.
 

     We all simultaneously embrace and fear the freedom of expression guaranteed to us. I have to trust that most of us take that responsibility seriously.

Edited by Washington Waddler
spelling
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 Just a little history for you all.

 

 Don Essig, who some of you probably know, was my sixth grade teacher. He took us on a field trip down to see the Beavs and Terry Baker play. The biggest thing about that trip for me was seeing the cheerleaders line up in two lines and the opposing team ran out while the yell squad was screaming “Fee Fi Fo Fum where the hell did you come from”. Still can’t get that out of my memory banks.

 

 Don was a member of the Beavs cheer squad While attending OS back in the sixties.  

 

 Don’s family owned a farm on the top of the hill in Oregon City which is where Oregon City High School now sits.

 

 Don became the voice at Autzen Stadium for all football games. Funny how small the world really is.

 

 Never could figure out How a Beavs cheer leader could become the voice of the Ducks, maybe Charles can straighten me out on that.

 

 My point is how a cheerleader has had a huge impact on anyone that has attended a game at Autzen and most probably don know he was a cheerleader. And a beaver cheerleader at that. Crazy.

 

 Go 🦆🦆🦆s

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Re: Objectification - Cheerleaders have done this for years, and signed up for the dancing, leaping, acrobatics, etc. They knowingly/voluntarily do it in front of 50,000-60,000+ fans at each football game while being shown on TV to another 1.0M + viewers. Call me "old-school", but if you knew what you were getting into when you signed up for it, I have relatively little sympathy if you then complain about it. I wouldn't be shocked if many of the cheerleaders have Instagram/TikTok accounts where they do far more questionable things to promote their "influence" and "brand".

 

Re: Use on OBD Forum - I can summarize what I'd like OBD Forum's approach to be:  TASTEFUL & RELEVANT.

 

The definition of "tasteful" will vary person to person so this will be a challenge, but I agree with @Annie in how provocative cheer and dance routines have become. I don't want to see videos of it, or even still images of those. That said, I believe cheerleaders are part of the Game Day experience and should be included in the OBD Forum if tasteful and relevant . . .

 

Perhaps as offensive to the senses as a distasteful picture, is a picture (even if tasteful; worse if not) used where it's not relevant. An article discussing Mari Cristbal's terrible offenses over the years, IMO, should not have a random cheerleader photo. Game Day articles, and other instances where it's relevant? Sure!

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Thanks for asking, Charles. I don't really mind one way or the other.

 

I consider myself a sports snob. While there is NOTHING like watching live game action from the stands, I've grown to prefer watching games on my 65" TV screen at home for numerous reasons beyond the ease of bathroom access and cheaper, colder beer. Among them is the increasing efforts at the stadium/arena to get me to stand up and cheer when somebody else deems it appropriate. I'm a pretty independent cuss, and I want to decide myself--following the action of the play on the field/court--when I want to stand and cheer or do something else. (The one notable exception to this is the "Shout" tradition between the 3rd and 4th quarters.)

 

I don't like sitting by the guy who's constantly yelling at the refs for "bad calls" all game long. I don't like sitting by the chatterbox who's talking about everything EXCEPT the game. I don't like doing "the wave" or participating in "Everybody clap your hands..."  AND, I don't like having cheerleaders try to tell me when to stand up and cheer. (I have to admit, though, that I DO enjoy seeing that old guy who brings binoculars to the game and only using them during timeouts to watch the cheerleaders.) And, don't even think about talking to me when the Ducks are performing badly unless you want to get your head bit off.  Okay, enough about my idiosyncrasies. 

 

This anecdote probably best sums up my attitude about cheerleaders. Back in the Kamikaze Kids era, I attended every basketball game at Mac Court. My usual perch was in the front row of the 3rd balcony, giving me a perfect bird's-eye view of the action on the court. (And, of course, the thrill of feeling the balcony swaying back and forth when the crowd really got going.) Well, one day I decided I'd make the commitment to sit courtside in the student section, which was mid-court in those days.

 

So, I got up at the crack of dawn and joined the two guys who'd apparently spent the night there. As the doors opened, I sprinted for the stands and got a seat a mid-court in the front row. Watching warm-ups was great as I could even hear conversations between players and coaches. Then, about two minutes before the national anthem, the cheerleaders trotted out and plopped down right in front of me.
 

As a college student, I loved looking at beautiful women just as much as the next guy, but I spent that entire game absolutely despising those blameless cheerleaders. STOP BLOCKING MY VIEW OF THE GAME ACTION, and STOP FORCING ME TO STAND UP ALL THE TIME!  After that, I ALWAYS relished my sprint up the numerous flights of stairs to the 3rd balcony for my unobstructed view of the game action. (And I NEVER brought binoculars along with me, either.)

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Per Haywarduck comment on strength.  One of the guys on my daughter's squad at Oregon used to be an offensive tackle. He had to give up football because of a neck injury.

 

 

He would lift a female cheerleader in each hand and they would stand on his hand in that pose above his head with both his arms extended.  That was strength!

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Cheerleading is part of the game day atmosphere.

Your answer is in the article "My gut tells me to allow reasonable photos that show actual cheering......and be selective about leaving out those that might have a racy appearance to them."

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I feel... If they are at a school sanctioned event, fully clothed in team gear, they are part of Oregon athletics. They should be supported, recognized, and treated just like any other athlete.

Edited by DUCati855
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I have never seen a picture on here that was offensive to me or tasteless.  Don’t really care if you use cheerleader photos or not and it is your site.  

 

Cheerleaders are at every game, so it isn’t something every fan on this site hasn’t seen.  

 

Agree that it takes strength and athleticism to do it.  Wish I could post my fave cheer picture, but this isn’t a Utah site.  Away game and opposing fan jumped out of the stands to try to take the U flag and our cheerleader pounded him!

 

The site is great.  Thanks

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Apparently "Cheerleader Photo" title lines draw more page views faster than those about football. 

 

Can indicators or conclusions be drawn from that? 

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I have always felt that cheerleaders were every bit the student athlete as ball players or students in any other sport. They put in the hours, practice on an off the field, and have the discipline to stick with their respective programs.

 

They are as much a part of the Oregon brand as are football players, baseball or softball, track and field, golf, or even basketball players. Photos are fine.

 

In reality, their uniforms are more modest than what we see in track and field, volleyball or the swim team.

Edited by PittDuck
Added another skimpily clad sport!
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Let’s just keep some sanity. If we eliminate the pretty people, we’re getting this on the sideline instead. 

AC8EA6FE-9D42-440B-A827-C222D9ADCB02.jpeg

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Im just going to pretend I never saw that photo.

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Other than the last photo (barf) maybe we should have some examples of what should be permitted?

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They can scandalize me as much as they like. I'll find some way to handel it.😇

It's been part of the game for ever, and after all who is it we're really trying to impress ?

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On 8/4/2022 at 5:21 AM, Log Haulin said:

I love beautiful. Especially when the insides match the outsides (rare). I like to watch others dance and sing. I like seeing people smile. 

 

Cheerleaders are men and women who participate in the game experience. They are having fun. Good times. 

Cheerleaders certainly are part of the game, but let’s be honest . Guys like to look at pretty girls, and perhaps that’s why on just about any telecast of a college football game the camera zooms in on the cheerleaders.


But have you noticed they rarely, if ever, feature a male cheerleader? It’s because the person behind the camera is a guy.

 

And what about the band? Not many close ups of the band and it’s a huge part of the game, too.

 

I think it was Annie who commented that basically she could care less about the cheerleaders. She’s there to watch football, period. Totally understandable.

 

Do I have a “problem” with cheerleader pix on FISHDUCK? Absolutely not.

 

But then I’m a guy.

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I have absolutely no problem with the occasional photo of cheerleaders. They add to the excitement of the game;  the game is still played at this level for the entertainment of fans.  I will allow the individual participants and the school to decide the choice of dress and routine.  Yes, these are 20 year olds and I am in favor of their being allowed to express themselves in an exuberant manner of their choice within the culture of University of Oregon.

 

 We will each have our own levels of pleasure or discontent with certain photos or routines.  This is more a reflection of our own personal perspective based, imo, upon our own layers of cultural preference and upbringing.  Let the youth express themselves artistically and athletically as individuals within the freedom provided by our University.  The cheerleaders are athletes and artists also and deserve out adulation, respect and freedom to perform to their best abilities.

 

I do not personally care whether we do or do not have the photos, I will deal with my own mind and allow the kids to grow into theirs as best they within their own  culture.  I trust my daughters to do what they feel best about. and assume our Cheerleading program is watching out for them.  I do not choose, personally, to impede the Cheerleaders expression with my own mind or expectations.

 

Go ducks, and this is absolutely not a political statement of any kind.  I totally support whatever Charles believes to be best for the health and success of this awesome site and will read, not read, look at photos or not, or comment upon specific comments or articles as I choose, and be grateful for the opportunity to do so.

 

 

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Oregon cheerleaders can be both distracting and motivating.
 

True story case in point. when I first arrived on campus I was driving my civic hatchback west on 18th and the cheerleaders were having a car wash on the corner at Hilyard. I ran the red light and was T Boned by an old couple in an Oldsmobile. And get this: the adjuster said it was MY fault!

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Nothing at all wrong with pics of cheerleaders, they are an extension of the game & tradition.

This is college football with real young people and gals that love to dance. These gals work very hard at their talents like the players do and deserve to be seen and appreciated.

Is someone is offended by the pics they don't have to look at the pics.

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They are inspirational! Just ask the Duck!

 

image.png.398ca8ee0c4c82a2b52fe53fc0959a6e.png  

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It's kind of interesting/funny that none of us have mentioned that some (6) of the cheerleaders are male, although they are listed as Stunt Base members of the cheer squad. 10 women are listed as Stunt Tops, and 15 women listed as Dancers.

 

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To ensure good taste, I suggest that cheerleader photos be allowed only if the cheerleader is, a.) carrying a football, b.) wearing a helmet, or c.) flipping off anyone from USC.

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