Organized Turmoil

[woodebutcher]

I  am an older Duck fan, from the time of George Pasero, sports writer and close follower of the Ducks.  From classic games in Multnomah Stadium, U. of O. v. the Huskies, Southern  Cal and such.  As a former student at the U. of O. the 1958 Rose Bowl game Oregon No 0 against Ohio State No. #1 in the nation with 3 All Americans in the backfield; especially "Bobby White."

 

A man from my fraternity house, Jerry Kershner,  others J.C. Wheeer, Ron Stover, Dave Fish, Harry Mondale, Charlie Tourville, Jack Morris were good average players who wanted to show the L.A. scribes, calling the boys fom "Oregon," stumpjumpers were going to lose by 50 + points?  One weapon the Buckeyes did not know;  we had a coach by the name of "Len Casonova who had his players finely tuned up and these guys could have walked on water when stepping onto the turf at the Rose bowl.  The Duck fans were vivid in their yellow and green outfits and the roar of the Oregon fans was deafening. 

 

These high spirited young stallions outplayed the Buckeyes in about every statistic except the score.  The final was  10-7, settled by a lone field goal as the Ducks missed theirs in the closing moments in the 4th quarter.  From watching many Duck games, the type of coaching is a key ingrediant to winning.  Rich Brooks, Chip Kelly, Len Casanova,  were the kind of coaches that were surrogate fathers. 

 

They were much more than coaches but men of unusual character that their players held in the highest respect and regard.  I have been witness to a rapid turnover of coaches in the last 6 years that does not bode well for a winning, championship  teams.  I know little to nothing of the new coaching staff coming to Oregon in 2022,  and do know a coach can make or break a team in winning and losing. 

 

As an old and loyal Duck I want to see the new coaches lite the spark and create the Ducks into a National Championship final.  As I am an ambitious  fan as Phil Knight, wanting this to become a reality and a national championship for the Ducks and the State of Oregon.

[Duck 1972]

Thanks for the memories and ponder points.

 

I wonder if the change in the attitude of the players has as much of an impact on the game as the coaches.

[MaiTaiDuck]

On 1/3/2022 at 9:01 PM, woodebutcher said:

I  am an older Duck fan, from the time of George Pasero, sports writer and close follower of the Ducks.  From classic games in Multnomah Stadium, U. of O. v. the Huskies, Southern  Cal and such.  As a former student at the U. of O. the 1958 Rose Bowl game Oregon No 0 against Ohio State No. #1 in the nation with 3 All Americans in the backfield; especially "Bobby White."

 

A man from my fraternity house, Jerry Kershner,  others J.C. Wheeer, Ron Stover, Dave Fish, Harry Mondale, Charlie Tourville, Jack Morris were good average players who wanted to show the L.A. scribes, calling the boys fom "Oregon," stumpjumpers were going to lose by 50 + points?  One weapon the Buckeyes did not know;  we had a coach by the name of "Len Casonova who had his players finely tuned up and these guys could have walked on water when stepping onto the turf at the Rose bowl.  The Duck fans were vivid in their yellow and green outfits and the roar of the Oregon fans was deafening. 

 

These high spirited young stallions outplayed the Buckeyes in about every statistic except the score.  The final was  10-7, settled by a lone field goal as the Ducks missed theirs in the closing moments in the 4th quarter.  From watching many Duck games, the type of coaching is a key ingrediant to winning.  Rich Brooks, Chip Kelly, Len Casanova,  were the kind of coaches that were surrogate fathers. 

 

They were much more than coaches but men of unusual character that their players held in the highest respect and regard.  I have been witness to a rapid turnover of coaches in the last 6 years that does not bode well for a winning, championship  teams.  I know little to nothing of the new coaching staff coming to Oregon in 2022,  and do know a coach can make or break a team in winning and losing. 

 

As an old and loyal Duck I want to see the new coaches lite the spark and create the Ducks into a National Championship final.  As I am an ambitious  fan as Phil Knight, wanting this to become a reality and a national championship for the Ducks and the State of Oregon.

Yes Sir!

[Jon Joseph]

Thanks for the great post. But Playoffs? Playoffs!

 

Since George Kliavkoff (GK) replaced Larry Scott the spin has stopped. No more spin, thank goodness GK tells the truth and talks the talk. GK knows how important it is for the Conference of Champions to win titles that matter: CFB and CBB titles. As GK says, 'the Pac-12 is in a valley.'

 

2017 -2021, the conference is 8-22 in postseason CFB play. 1-5 in NY6 bowls. Zero Playoff invites.

 

In 2021 vs FBS opponents out-of-conference the Pac-12 went 9-18. The Pac-12 went 0-5 in its 2021 bowls including the first loss to a MAC school in 18 years. Pac-12 recruiting is simply bad. The Orange bowl between Georgia and Michigan featured starting QBs from Reno and 'LA.' The Heisman winner, Bryce Young from 'LA" is the QB at Bama. The Rose Bowl winning QB, Ohio State's Stroud, is from LA. Insult to injury, QB Dillon Gabriel just flipped his commitment from UCLA to Oklahoma. Understandable with the Bruins having a lame duck (sorry Puddles) head coach. And it appears that Oklahoma QB Caleb Williams will not be following Lincoln Riley to SC but will instead be signing with Georgia.

 

From 2014-2018 participation in high school football in California dropped 11.7% During this same period participation dropped 3.2% in Georgia and 0.6% in Florida. 

 

The Pac-12 average head coach and assistant coach salaries are the lowest in the G5. Washington State lost a winning head coach to a bottom feeder SEC program. CU could not come close to matching Michigan State's offer to Mel Tucker. 

 

USC opened the wallet for Oklahoma head coach Lincoln Riley and the assistants he brought with him. SC has also significantly upped its recruiting budget including hiring additional staff to help with recruiting. Oregon is paying 'market value' for a new coach without head coaching experience and for his staff. Yet, Oregon spends approximately $1.3M per annum on recruiting. One third of what Georgia spends on recruiting. Only Vandy in the SEC spends less than Oregon on recruiting.

 

Many the Pac-12 stadia are 'empty' and silent on game day. One has to ask if all 12 conference teams and their respective administrators are all-in in being competitive in CFB and CBB? And, even if all-in do they have the money to spend that is required to be competitive in the money ball sports? 

 

The Pac-12 under the current media agreement is stuck with lousy, late kick off times. The Pac-12 Network is a functionally insolvent albatross. Having decided not to expand into the central time zone by adding Sugar Bowl winner Baylor, Fiesta Bowl winner Oklahoma State, a Houston team that defeated Auburn, a Texas Tech squad that blew out Mississippi State, bowl eligible Iowa State and Kansas State and basketball power Kansas, along with top to bottom strong CBB programs, what does GK have to sell come media renegotiation time other than what Larry Scott had to sell? 

 

Oregon and USC are spending the money necessary to compete at the highest level. Yet, the Ducks and Trojans get the same revenue share as do schools that do not come close to spending the same amount of money. ROI wise, SC and Oregon are taking it in the financial shorts.

 

Go 13-0 and as a P5 champ and you will be in the Playoff. But 13-0 is a big ask when you go 'on the road' versus Georgia, play BYU out-of-conference and then play 5 conference road games. Since the Pac-12 added CU and Utah, no Pac-12 team has gone 13-0. As weak as the conference is, 12-1 does not by any means guarantee a Playoff spot.

 

Oregon is in a tough position. I fervently hope that before Oregon pledges its media rights to the new Pac-12 media deal that it will consider other alternatives? Alternatives where there will be an opportunity to make more money and to play with partners willing and able to spend the money required to be competitive.

 

Again, thanks for the terrific comment.

[HappyToBeADuck]

The new commissioner has nothing more to bring to the table than Scott did.  Nothing.......

 

The west coast offers late night entertainment for the east and Midwest time zone viewers. 

 

Even Scott new enough to get into the Midwest time zone. Especially Texas. Offering content from noon eastern until the lights get turned off in the wee hours.

 

Granted Texas and Oklahoma were big game to hunt down. They were hunted and captured by the SEC.

 

Baylor, OSU, TT and even Houston are not Texas and Oklahoma. Granted. But they are not leftovers. The state of Texas and the lower mid west have millions of eyeballs. More fans in that region hate Longhorn or Sooner, anything.

 

Now Baylor, OSU and others have a better shot at division or conference Championships. They will be in the national conversation. So will Cincinnati and BYU. But now we allowed them to gain P5 conference status.

 

The P-12 Network, though a failure is the only chip at the table. Give it to one of the networks and they will showcase the top teams in the PAC. And not always after dark.

 

Oregon and USC are the PAC's best bargaining chips. But they are devalued with their fellow members. Not because the other members are bad partners. 

 

It's because neither Oregon or USC can dominate a weak conference, convincingly......

[Jon Joseph]

On 1/5/2022 at 9:24 AM, HappyToBeADuck said:

The new commissioner has nothing more to bring to the table than Scott did.  Nothing.......

 

The west coast offers late night entertainment for the east and Midwest time zone viewers. 

 

Even Scott new enough to get into the Midwest time zone. Especially Texas. Offering content from noon eastern until the lights get turned off in the wee hours.

 

Granted Texas and Oklahoma were big game to hunt down. They were hunted and captured by the SEC.

 

Baylor, OSU, TT and even Houston are not Texas and Oklahoma. Granted. But they are not leftovers. The state of Texas and the lower mid west have millions of eyeballs. More fans in that region hate Longhorn or Sooner, anything.

 

Now Baylor, OSU and others have a better shot at division or conference Championships. They will be in the national conversation. So will Cincinnati and BYU. But now we allowed them to gain P5 conference status.

 

The P-12 Network, though a failure is the only chip at the table. Give it to one of the networks and they will showcase the top teams in the PAC. And not always after dark.

 

Oregon and USC are the PAC's best bargaining chips. But they are devalued with their fellow members. Not because the other members are bad partners. 

 

It's because neither Oregon or USC can dominate a weak conference, convincingly......

 

Great take. Great! Recently it was stated by a number of Ducks fans that the Pac-12 should stay as-is because quality means more than quantity. Really?

 

Baylor won the Sugar Bowl and last season won the NCAA basketball tournament. OK ST defeated Notre Dame in the Fiesta Bowl. Houston beat Auburn. Texas Tech demolished MS ST and a few years back won the CBB title. K State just blew out LSU. Kansas, no bowl but an improving CFB team and always a top CBB team. Bowl eligible Iowa State lost a close bowl game to Clemson. TCU, no bowl in 2021 but a win over CAL and more importantly, the Dallas, TEXAS market.

[Duckhart]

On 1/4/2022 at 10:11 AM, Jon Joseph said:

Thanks for the great post. But Playoffs? Playoffs!

 

Since George Kliavkoff (GK) replaced Larry Scott the spin has stopped. No more spin, thank goodness GK tells the truth and talks the talk. GK knows how important it is for the Conference of Champions to win titles that matter: CFB and CBB titles. As GK says, 'the Pac-12 is in a valley.'

 

2017 -2021, the conference is 8-22 in postseason CFB play. 1-5 in NY6 bowls. Zero Playoff invites.

 

In 2021 vs FBS opponents out-of-conference the Pac-12 went 9-18. The Pac-12 went 0-5 in its 2021 bowls including the first loss to a MAC school in 18 years. Pac-12 recruiting is simply bad. The Orange bowl between Georgia and Michigan featured starting QBs from Reno and 'LA.' The Heisman winner, Bryce Young from 'LA" is the QB at Bama. The Rose Bowl winning QB, Ohio State's Stroud, is from LA. Insult to injury, QB Dillon Gabriel just flipped his commitment from UCLA to Oklahoma. Understandable with the Bruins having a lame duck (sorry Puddles) head coach. And it appears that Oklahoma QB Caleb Williams will not be following Lincoln Riley to SC but will instead be signing with Georgia.

 

From 2014-2018 participation in high school football in California dropped 11.7% During this same period participation dropped 3.2% in Georgia and 0.6% in Florida. 

 

The Pac-12 average head coach and assistant coach salaries are the lowest in the G5. Washington State lost a winning head coach to a bottom feeder SEC program. CU could not come close to matching Michigan State's offer to Mel Tucker. 

 

USC opened the wallet for Oklahoma head coach Lincoln Riley and the assistants he brought with him. SC has also significantly upped its recruiting budget including hiring additional staff to help with recruiting. Oregon is paying 'market value' for a new coach without head coaching experience and for his staff. Yet, Oregon spends approximately $1.3M per annum on recruiting. One third of what Georgia spends on recruiting. Only Vandy in the SEC spends less than Oregon on recruiting.

 

Many the Pac-12 stadia are 'empty' and silent on game day. One has to ask if all 12 conference teams and their respective administrators are all-in in being competitive in CFB and CBB? And, even if all-in do they have the money to spend that is required to be competitive in the money ball sports? 

 

The Pac-12 under the current media agreement is stuck with lousy, late kick off times. The Pac-12 Network is a functionally insolvent albatross. Having decided not to expand into the central time zone by adding Sugar Bowl winner Baylor, Fiesta Bowl winner Oklahoma State, a Houston team that defeated Auburn, a Texas Tech squad that blew out Mississippi State, bowl eligible Iowa State and Kansas State and basketball power Kansas, along with top to bottom strong CBB programs, what does GK have to sell come media renegotiation time other than what Larry Scott had to sell? 

 

Oregon and USC are spending the money necessary to compete at the highest level. Yet, the Ducks and Trojans get the same revenue share as do schools that do not come close to spending the same amount of money. ROI wise, SC and Oregon are taking it in the financial shorts.

 

Go 13-0 and as a P5 champ and you will be in the Playoff. But 13-0 is a big ask when you go 'on the road' versus Georgia, play BYU out-of-conference and then play 5 conference road games. Since the Pac-12 added CU and Utah, no Pac-12 team has gone 13-0. As weak as the conference is, 12-1 does not by any means guarantee a Playoff spot.

 

Oregon is in a tough position. I fervently hope that before Oregon pledges its media rights to the new Pac-12 media deal that it will consider other alternatives? Alternatives where there will be an opportunity to make more money and to play with partners willing and able to spend the money required to be competitive.

 

Again, thanks for the terrific comment.

Nice take. The interest in college football on the west coast has slipped over the last number of years. IMO, its a combination of things, more options for things to do, other sports and general demographics, and dominance from other conferences. 

The trend will continue until the Pac 12 gets more competitive.

[Mike West]

The PAC12 will get better when the conference Presidents make revenue sports the focal point.  

 

We already know money is driving the sport.  College Football is basically minor league football.  

 

The players finally get a shot at decent paydays, which is only fair given the greed in the sport.  

 

We can go Ivy League West if we want.  That is an automatic trend towards G5 status as far as I'm concerned. 

 

Let's just call a spade a spade and be done with it.  We will be left behind if we continue to promote Olympics Sports as our claim to Fame (and we may end up driving them out of business as a result).  

 

Just saying.