FishDuck Article Administrator No. 1 Share Posted March 19 Admittedly, I am weary of reading posters to the Our Beloved Ducks message board chastise OSU and WSU over funds in the PAC-12 accounts, and that will come into those accounts that they have received through Court Order. It was not hard to pull Mr. FishDuck from his study of popular gambling states in the US since he has demonstrated strong feelings with this topic... What were Oregon State and WSU Supposed to Do? | FishDuck FISHDUCK.COM Admittedly, I am weary of reading posters to the Our Beloved Ducks message board chastise OSU and WSU over funds in the PAC-12 accounts, and that will come into… 1 1 1 Two Sites: FishDuck and the Our Beloved Ducks forum, The only "Forum with Decorum!" And All-Volunteer? What a wonderful community of Duck fans! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Administrator No. 2 Share Posted March 19 I will admit to having strong feelings, and sharing them often here. However, it is important to see all sides on the issues, thus why I do not censor writers from sharing their opinions--even when they are contrary to mine. This is how we learn from one-another, and viewpoints can be changed over time. I do not argue the legality of their actions, and you have not ever seen anything from me in that sphere. I go by is what-is-right; the "Pig-2" did not earn the money they are taking, thus it is legalized stealing. In fact the free-market has shown their value to be considerably under the rest of the Pac-12, yet they were paid an equal share for decades. They did not earn that full share either. Stealing then, and stealing now. Trying to hide behind the legality does not obscure what you are doing to fellow conference members who operated fairly, and in good faith for over 100 years. I have not heard any apology from them, or even shame. The sooner we leave them behind...the better. Riding Shotgun Without Doing Your Part Will Leave You Stuck 2 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanLduck No. 3 Share Posted March 19 Thanks for this.post. We may not like it, but it's clear in the contractual agreement. These monies will help those 2 schools for only so long. The latest announcements from new CFP prove they are relegated to G5 status, at best. And realistically justified. Their only hope for blue-chip players will be NIL. I'm betting even the Civil War game will lose interest and become less then yearly. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph No. 4 Share Posted March 19 A contractual agreement even with 10 of the 12 partners leaving the firm with the two lowest partners on the totem pole remaining is meritorious? If the Pac 8 had decent legal representation they would have called a board meeting before giving notice and changed the by-laws. What happens when the Pac-2 goes to the MW or reverse mergers with the MW? Do you think the P2 will share the quasi-purloined funds with their new MW friends? Of course not because the Pac-2 will argue that MW west teams had nothing to do with earning the money. Other than providing cannon fodder, what did the Pac-2 contribute to post-season revenue? Nada. You do not get paid for winning baseball tournaments. OSU keeps its CBB money fine. And I'd settle for giving both teams more than what they earned but not the entire enchilada. It's theft using a huckster trick but it worked with the suckers in charge of the Pac-8. If the Pac-10 filed suit in Salt Lake City and hired Ballard Sparh as counsel I'm reasonably certain that a state court judge could have ruled differently than a state court judge in Bum Fork, Washington. Hats off to the Pac-2 for hiring lawyers good for their side and Go to Hades to the Pac-10 folks that let this happen without a fight. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JabbaNoBargain No. 5 Share Posted March 19 (edited) Great article. They are doing exactly what they should do. Doesn’t mean I don’t think we could have approached things differently. In the end, they are getting crumbs that will help them for about 1 year as things currently stand. That being said, we should have given the rivalry the year off. Giving up a home game and donating a home game to them while they continue to act like they’re doing us a favor by agreeing to play us, while continuing to fleece us, bad mouth us, all while securing additional funding from the state. Way more context at play than preserving history and I think gifting them a home game was a bad call by us. Edited March 19 by JabbaNoBargain 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solar No. 6 Share Posted March 19 (edited) Competition comes in many forms. Let's face it. OSU and WSU finally won something. And if Pac 12 leadership supported by outgoing school presidents was dumb enough to set a bad legal precedent, then they deserve to lose....and by logic, OSU and WSU deserve to win. Let's tip the cap to them and move on like everything else. Judging by the new CFP contract arrangement, ex p12 schools beat them this time. and the pac 2 may never win this type of competition again. Edited March 19 by Solar 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Sousa No. 7 Share Posted March 19 Thanks for the article. I, too, do not understand the vitriol thrown at the two schools. As I pointed out a month or two ago, in another post, that what we might lose financially and simply be understood and accepted as akin to whoever wants to poach Dan Lanning from Oregon would have to pay Oregon $20 million. It is simply the cost of making the move. The title of the article asks a very good question: What were they supposed to do??? I haven't seen or heard any reasonable answer to that question other than the answer in the article. One thing I am certain of: If Oregon was left in the PAC, they would have done exactly the same thing. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Administrator No. 8 Share Posted March 20 On 3/19/2024 at 4:42 PM, Jon Sousa said: I haven't seen or heard any reasonable answer to that question The key question to ask is...."what would have OSU/WSU have done if they were invited to a Power-5 conference?" Simple. We would have split the assets and revenue streams 12 ways. Right? So because the Pig-2 did not build their brand and audience...ten other teams are supposed to be penalized for their incompetence? To the tune of 255 million dollars? Yes, I know it is legal. But c'mon...is that fair? Beaver and Cougar Fans tell us to... Forget fair. 1 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duckster No. 9 Share Posted March 20 Good article Mike and appreciate the perspective. All's I will add is that the concept of "Legality" in the world in which we now live is governed more by perspective than in any era I can remember. You can throw the concept of "Fair and Balanced" in there as well ... There was little or no chance Oregon would stay and latch its' star to the two bottom feeders once the Pac 12 started to implode. You can't just throw 25+ years, and countless millions in Brand Building down the drain (nor 7 years of college for that matter ). Dan Lanning would assuredly be at Alabama now if we hadn't jumped ... I posted earlier in another response that Mullin's made a huge mistake scheduling the Beavers this year. The rivalry as we know it is now dead. Take a year off and find creative ways to re-establish how the contest should move forward. Meanwhile, the environment of this years game will be toxic and some good young dudes, who had absolutely nothing to do with the demise of the Pac-12 will bear the brunt of the vitriol. So ... cancel the game and replace it by gathering all the knuckleheads who actually WERE responsible for the demise of the conference and put them in a ring. Gather a representative from each member school... like say Bill Walton for UCLA ... then fill a bunch of socks full of Horse S and let the fun begin. I actually would buy a ticket for that ... 1 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudslide No. 10 Share Posted March 20 I wonder ..... can we agree that everything about the recent administration and leadership of the PAC-12, including its media and member parachute agreements were more than ill-conceived? I grudgingly admit that the injunctive relief will hold. The "PiG-2, as Charles nicely calls them, will be getting a windfall as a reward for their failure ... failure matched only by the wretched performing league office(s). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duckley Palace No. 11 Share Posted March 20 What should they have done? How about actually trying to pull their weight years ago, and make the Pac -12 better in the revenue generating sports. Not waiting till 2018 to invest into stadium renovations. How about not allowing yourself to be an anchor, and counting on your in state brothers pull you along. Then acting like they betrayed you after years of pulling your sorry carcass. How about giving a wink after you won money not owed to you, and finally owning up to your failures. If the Big Ten had offered you membership at a ten percent revenue sharing percentage, you'd jump. Facts are you didn't put in the work, but you want the rewards of your harder working brother. That's a loser mentality, and it's a major issue in society today. " I didn't fail, the system kept me down. Give me a handout, I will sit on my butt waiting for it.". To anybody that's made something of themselves, seen their children do the same, and hopefully live to see their grandkids do the same. You know what that means. Do you wanna make something of yourself, or excuses for why you never will? As long as your lungs draw air, it's not too late. But some people wake up looking for slights and excuses. Oregon chose to be better, that's why they're an elite AD with great backing. Oregon State chose to just be content in a changing market. They never thought a 108 year old house would crumble. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Administrator No. 12 Share Posted March 20 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven A Moderator No. 13 Share Posted March 20 On 3/19/2024 at 2:37 PM, Jon Joseph said: If the Pac 8 had decent legal representation they would have called a board meeting before giving notice and changed the by-laws. Right on! Or, if having seen the LA schools lose their board seats/votes, what if the other 8 had just "signed-on" with the other conferences in ""principle"" without giving formal notice of withdrawal, the legal mess would have been bigger and maybe more leverage in the "buy-out" terms. Of course, none of that changes what is left of the Pac, dare I say the "Pac Turds" (since we all know what a number 2 is)? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duxster No. 14 Share Posted March 20 A contract is contractually binding. It doesn't matter if we don't think it's "fair" or "right". If the contract gives the right to the $$$ to OSU and WSU, it's in their best interests to take it. Every team leaving the Pac-12 acted in their own best interest, without considering what their actions did to the other conference schools. Why should we hold the Pac-2 to a different standard? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JabbaNoBargain No. 15 Share Posted March 20 On 3/20/2024 at 11:03 AM, Duxster said: A contract is contractually binding. It doesn't matter if we don't think it's "fair" or "right". If the contract gives the right to the $$$ to OSU and WSU, it's in their best interests to take it. Every team leaving the Pac-12 acted in their own best interest, without considering what their actions did to the other conference schools. Why should we hold the Pac-2 to a different standard? A leech may successfully latch on, but it’s still a leech. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph No. 16 Share Posted March 20 Mike, I disagree with you but I certainly do not mean to be disagreeable. You made your case very well and I appreciate you making this effort. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph No. 17 Share Posted March 20 On 3/20/2024 at 2:12 PM, JabbaNoBargain said: A leech may successfully latch on, but it’s still a leech. Contracts and challenged, torn up, and renegotiated every day. If you are a lender and the borrower files for bankruptcy reorganization your contract is subject to being renegotiated by the court. Maryland sued the ACC over its exit fee when it left for the B1G and saved millions of dollars. The powers-that-be at Maryland should have simply said, 'Oh, well?' Are you aware of the money these two schools that did little or nothing to earn the money are grabbing? If the Pac-10 had pursued a remedy outside of Washington the settlement amount would not be close to what the Pac-2 are getting. 12 people form a business. 10 depart without having to pay an exit fee. The 2 left are entitled to the Good Will and all of the assets and the ten departees are still on the hook for their share of liabilities? Only a group of fools would agree to this. Only academicians would agree to anything this onerous. The Pac-2 will not share with their new partners. They'll drain what they stole and then join the G5. It's a rip-off. None of the 10 being hosed over agreed to this kind of resolution at the time the by-laws were agreed to. 8 out of 12 would have been enough to change the by-laws if the departing 8's lawyers and the Pac-12's lawyers had not been asleep at the switch. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDuck No. 18 Share Posted March 20 "No member shall deliver a notice of withdrawal to the Conference in the period beginning on July 24, 2011, and ending on August 1, 2024" Well apparently, the emphasis fell on the word "deliver" which none of the first 8 escapees grasped. They all gave notice to be "effective August 1, 2024" and the recipient conferences issued press releases that new teams were joining "effective August 1". It's akin to a renter telling the landlord that she is getting married in six months and will be moving out after six months. Neither the renter or the landlord expect any change in financial arrangements until the move-out date arrives. I suppose in retrospect, the 8 should have let rumors magnify and fly around for months all the while claiming, "we're proud members of the Pac12", then bingo bango bongo issue press releases on August 1 that they no longer want to be. Commissioner George K could have been even more frozen in media negotiations for several more months not knowing whether he was representing 12 or 10 or 8 or 2? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Administrator No. 19 Share Posted March 20 On 3/20/2024 at 12:26 PM, Jon Joseph said: The Pac-2 will not share with their new partners. They'll drain what they stole and then join the G5. It's a rip-off. Precisely right. Any other interpretation is delusion... No matter how much money they spend--the free market has told them they are a Group-of-5 set of teams, and nothing will change that, since they have been that way all along. They will get future media contracts based on this truth, and they can use the extortion money to stave off the inevitable of fitting in with Liberty, San Jose State, etc., but it will happen. They don't want to even hear reality. Pig-2 and Their Fans... 1 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duxster No. 20 Share Posted March 20 On 3/20/2024 at 1:12 PM, JabbaNoBargain said: A leech may successfully latch on, but it’s still a leech. All the best Jabba. Go Ducks! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph No. 21 Share Posted March 20 (edited) The 2024 game in Corvallis instead of playing Texas Tech in Eugene is a $6M to $8M+ hit to the local Eugene/Springfield economy. Was this taken into consideration? It would be interesting to know how much money had to be returned for rooms reserved for the Texas Tech game. Travel Lane County WWW.EUGENECASCADESCOAST.ORG Fans cheered the Ducks as they returned to the gridiron against Fresno State, but it was local businesses cheering more as fans dropped cold hard cash over the weekend. Edited March 20 by Jon Joseph 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven A Moderator No. 22 Share Posted March 20 On 3/20/2024 at 1:55 PM, Jon Joseph said: The 2024 game in Corvallis instead of playing Texas Tech in Eugene is a $6M to $8M+ hit to the local Eugene/Springfield economy. Well, they will more than make up for it with their "enterprise pricing" for the BIG fans that will be flooding the area. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter1997 No. 23 Share Posted March 21 Legal theft is still theft. Stealing money that they didn't earn. Why does that sound familiar? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter1997 No. 24 Share Posted March 21 I used to root for the nutria unless they played the ducks, but no longer. I hope and pray they lose every single game or match they play in every sport until the end of time. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haywarduck Moderator No. 25 Share Posted March 21 We can blame the presidents, athletic directors, but who was the Pac-12 commissioner in 2011 when the bylaws were written and signed in 2011? You guessed it, the gift that keeps giving, or taking..... 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
