Kickers Deserve Scholarships, Too

[FishDuck Article]

Most of the focus in football is placed on the star power positions like quarterbacks, running backs, receivers and standout defenders. As a result, in this new era of the transfer portal and NIL, most of the funds go to these star players. These are the players who make up the bulk of each school’s 85 scholarships. There are three ...

 

Read the full article here...

[Steven A]

"but these scholarships are solely for kickers, punters and long snappers and cannot be used in any other way."

 

Meaning none of them are allowed on the field for any other purpose . end of story

 

So, no Bill Veecking and seeing that long snapper also being used on KO, punt coverage, defense or backup tight end, etc.

 

 

[Haywarduck]

The kicker, punter and long snapper are an important job, and skill. It is also very critical and programs which don't prioritize the position are punished.

 

These positions have their own camps, and coaches. Parents, probably play the scholarship game harder for these kids then just about any position other than qb. Affluent white kids go to these camps to get scholarships and positions on football teams. Programs then feed off these camps, and suffer and thrive.

 

Some thrive when they can find an elite kicker out of the camps. Others suffer when they rely too much on the camps recommendations and then don't coach up a kicker. I think the other way is to find a Kattleman, and coach him up. The NFL is littered with ex-soccer players who took up kicking. No camp, just years of practice, refocused on football.

 

As far as more scholarships for these positions I am not sure about that. I think it is just another way of providing competition between programs. If we give more scholarships the elite will just get more of the 5* talent. I think the 85 scholarship limit has been one of the better rules the NCAA created. If we mess with that then the big boys will just rule even more.

 

I do think you bring up a great subject. Some programs see the importance of their special teams. Others it seems it is an after thought.

 

I think Oregon's special teams suffered under Cristobal. These positions, and the special teams weren't a priority to the tough guy football Mario wanted to play. This is another area it will be interesting to watch Lanning take over. I hope he wants to be elite in this area too, and makes it a priority.

[HappyToBeADuck]

David thanks for shedding some light on the subject. After reading it again it chaps my ...... that those in power aren't fighting for a fair solution.

 

Any player who is controlled by rules especially the rules of the coach should be compensated with a scholarship. If they step on the field, for just one play, and take any risk they should be compensated. In layman's terms if they have to show up for work (practice) and put in the time....they need to be compensated. 

 

IMHO, the schools president, AD and HC should have been up in arms against the NCAA to make adjustments to the scholarship rules.......

 

All the schools should have been involved to facilitate a change.

 

Why didn't they?

 

All those in power constantly spout off what's in the best interest of the student athlete. 

 

If they even remotely cared they would have championed a change. 

 

Let me see if I got this straight......

 

Son, parents, we want your boy to come to our school. Practice all year long and then win us some games. Be the hero, show team and school spirit. We want him bad and for this great privilege it will only cost you this much money........WTH

 

I get that rules are the rules. But if those in power truly cared they would fight for change.

 

In this day and age, thru social media, any change can happen. But somebody has to get the ball rolling. Now that the NCAA has been effectively neutered this should be eady.

[HappyToBeADuck]

On 12/24/2021 at 7:16 AM, Steven A said:

"but these scholarships are solely for kickers, punters and long snappers and cannot be used in any other way."

 

Meaning none of them are allowed on the field for any other purpose . end of story

 

So, no Bill Veecking and seeing that long snapper also being used on KO, punt coverage, defense or backup tight end, etc.

 

 

Very strict rules or regulations have to be in play. Keep the 85 scholarship limit in place.....

 

Then offer 6 special team scholarships for kicker, punter and long snapper.

 

And as you pointed out those should be the only positions they can play.

 

These young men have to come to work at specific days and time. They have to practice their trade. They need fair compensation.

 

And the coaches need clear, concise and binding rules in place on these scholarships.

[Logger29]

A lot of down time for me today, so I will bore you all with my worthless opinions.

 

I have a totally different take on this issue.

 

But first, glad someone has mentioned the poor quality of Duck special teams during Mario’s tenure. It was very disappointing and lack of kick off and punt coverage was a factor in keeping games too close for comfort.

 

To the point, no I don’t think punters and place kickers need special carve out scholarships.

 

In fact, I advocate for a drastic change. New rule: before any kick the player kicking must have participated in a minimum of one play from scrimmage.

 

Ever since high school, when some new teammate, often a soccer player, mysteriously appeared  at practice after the end of summer daily doubles, and was introduced as Franz the kicker, my regard for equating kickers with football players has been mostly that of suspicion.

 

In my experience, the kicker and holder ( usually one of the team equipment managers) spent the practice sessions kicking and drinking Gatorade. 
 

I realize things have changed. Kickers have developed incredible skill and the kicking game is critical to success, but common on man doesn’t it fry you that critical games come down to a guy who never has to launder his uniform?

 

Aw, just kidding - sort of!

[latracey]

As David so astutely points out in the article, "A good kick is a win and a missed kick is a loss, and the kicker has no control over where the ball will be located in terms of range or between the hashes. They just need to go out and kick the ball and score."

 

One of the things that frustrated me the most about Mario and other Oregon football coaches is the refusal to offer scholarships to the kickers they recruited. Kickers are perhaps the second most valuable players on a team and having a great kicker is extremely valuable to a team's overall success.

 

Being able to kick deep into the opposing team's end zone on kick offs saves field position and eliminates the possibility of the other team scoring a touch down on the kick off. Being able to be almost automatic from 40 yards out or closer results in victories more often than not. 

 

Recruiting 5 star kickers and punters, and offering them scholarships, should be a top priority every season. 

[30Duck]

On 12/24/2021 at 9:32 AM, Logger29 said:

New rule: before any kick the player kicking must have participated in a minimum of one play from scrimmage.

 

I understand the idea of assimilating the kicker into the team, But this seems to do more damage than good. I don't want the kicker on the LOS. Don't think he's going to find the hole and take it to the end zone as an RB, or catch one over the middle, or get a pick 6 as a corner. 

 

They're kickers, and they do that better than anybody else on the team can. 

[HappyToBeADuck]

Just an additional thought.

 

Non scholarship kicker sets up for a game winning field goal in a P5 conference championship game.

 

Make the kick and you send your team to the CFP. The school and conference divide up millions of dollars. Reap the recruiting rewards that follow, yet........

 

We can't carve out a scholarship because of rules.  If we can have NIL dollars flowing then why not target specific scholarships.....

 

Maybe I am bitter because my son played 3 years of D1 ball while on a full ride ACADEMIC SCHOLARSHIP.

 

IMHO, The school and coaching staff had no problem with that.....

 

Just saying.

[Logger29]

Well, not at all serious, but just suppose the rule were put in place, what might the unintended consequences be?

 

If football players were now expected to at least attempt to kick the ball at an early age - Pop Warner or Pee Wee - and coaches had to address kicking techniques early on, rather than recruiting kickers ready made from a pool of soccer players that were smart enough to realize the money in the NFL is much better than in the MLS, how might that look?

 

Could be 6’5” tight ends can also be elite kickers. I have no data only a hunch based on my little knowledge of physics, guys that size with the proper coaching might make 60 yarders common place. So long Franz, good kick Bubba.

[Haywarduck]

I agree with Logger29 on this one. The idea a kicker is working out, studying film, working on the playbook like a linebacker is comical at best. 

 

They are incredibly important, but it is a completely different position and situation within the team from a real player.

 

Maybe there should be a different level of scholarship available to kickers, punters, and longsnappers unless they actually play in the game, the real game.

 

 

[David Marsh]

I hear that kickers, long snappers and punters don't train the same way and that can be a rub for some. 

 

The other side of it is if there are scholarships for kickers then wouldn't everyone just want to be a kicker? No... I think the vast majority of those who play football and grow up watching football don't look at the kicker as the person they want to be in the field. 

 

Again... As fans we want to be able to ignore the kicker, punter and long snapper for the entire game. We want them to be SUPER boring because if they do their jobs right we don't know they exist and if the game doesn't depend on a field goal to win the offense has done its job.

 

No die hard football fan dreams of being a kicker. Beyond that only a handful of the best of the best specialists make it to the NFL. Then once in the NFL they do have long careers which makes it difficult for new specialists to make it to the NFL. 

 

Might as well give them a scholarship at college... Or maybe at the very least a partial scholarship... Give them something. 

[1Ducker1]

This thread has me remembering Maldonado. 

[JDuck]

On 12/24/2021 at 7:16 AM, Steven A said:

"but these scholarships are solely for kickers, punters and long snappers and cannot be used in any other way."

 

Meaning none of them are allowed on the field for any other purpose . end of story

 

So, no Bill Veecking and seeing that long snapper also being used on KO, punt coverage, defense or backup tight end, etc.

 

 

Good point, could come into play somewhere, but I think it's a good idea nonetheless and figure out how to keep it from being abused

[JDuck]

On 12/24/2021 at 9:32 AM, Logger29 said:

A lot of down time for me today, so I will bore you all with my worthless opinions.

 

I have a totally different take on this issue.

 

But first, glad someone has mentioned the poor quality of Duck special teams during Mario’s tenure. It was very disappointing and lack of kick off and punt coverage was a factor in keeping games too close for comfort.

 

To the point, no I don’t think punters and place kickers need special carve out scholarships.

 

In fact, I advocate for a drastic change. New rule: before any kick the player kicking must have participated in a minimum of one play from scrimmage.

 

Ever since high school, when some new teammate, often a soccer player, mysteriously appeared  at practice after the end of summer daily doubles, and was introduced as Franz the kicker, my regard for equating kickers with football players has been mostly that of suspicion.

 

In my experience, the kicker and holder ( usually one of the team equipment managers) spent the practice sessions kicking and drinking Gatorade. 
 

I realize things have changed. Kickers have developed incredible skill and the kicking game is critical to success, but common on man doesn’t it fry you that critical games come down to a guy who never has to launder his uniform?

 

Aw, just kidding - sort of!

Let's just go to XFL rules then   no clean uniforms!!!

[David Marsh]

On 12/24/2021 at 11:34 AM, 1Ducker1 said:

This thread has me remembering Maldonado. 

Camden Lewis is kinda the new version of Maldonado. 

 

Also Aiden Schider broke some records for kicking and consistency at Oregon but he was a walk on (at least for the majority of his time at Oregon). He tried out for an NFL team and hated it so he stopped his pursuit of that. 

[Jon Joseph]

Thanks DM. Loved it when the Army FG kicker who was 1-4 from 40 yards out hit a 41 yard walk off winning FG vs MIZZOU.

 

I think one of the great stories from 2021 is how Lewis turned his game around and surprised many of us by beating out Katelman.

[David Marsh]

On 12/24/2021 at 11:57 AM, Jon Joseph said:

 

I think one of the great stories from 2021 is how Lewis turned his game around and surprised many of us by beating out Katelman.

Then the baffling kicking disaster that was the Utah games... But I won't hold that against him... Again distance and ball placement on those attempts was pretty bad. One was outright blocked which wasn't Lewis' job to provide protection and it's not like the snap and catch was messed up. 

 

Also... A few more points would have helped moral in those games but they would still have been losses.

 

I am fine with Lewis being the kicker for next year ... But I really feel we need someone with a bigger leg for kick offs. Lewis struggled to get that ball reliably in the end zone for touch backs. 

 

Matt Wogan many years back was super unexciting from a fans point of view for both teams. He basically got rid of the opposing team's return game by kicking the ball right out the back of the end zone every time. 

[DanLduck]

This is what NIL can be used for, a booster can pay schollies for all "walkon" kickers and longsnappers.

[Jon Joseph]

On 12/24/2021 at 10:49 AM, HappyToBeADuck said:

Very strict rules or regulations have to be in play. Keep the 85 scholarship limit in place.....

 

Then offer 6 special team scholarships for kicker, punter and long snapper.

 

And as you pointed out those should be the only positions they can play.

 

These young men have to come to work at specific days and time. They have to practice their trade. They need fair compensation.

 

And the coaches need clear, concise and binding rules in place on these scholarships.

 

In 2022 you are allowed 7 additional players on scholarship; 92 instead of 85. I think the powers that be wanted to help out the many, many guys in the portal. And due to 2020 not counting against eligibility guys who would have run out of eligibility are still on rosters.

[David Marsh]

On 12/24/2021 at 12:48 PM, DanLduck said:

This is what NIL can be used for, a booster can pay schollies for all "walkon" kickers and longsnappers.

Absolutely possible... But will anyone with that kind of money want to pay for specialists? Wouldn't they prefer to pay for any other position on the field and get some real star power for their dollars?  

[Wood Duck]

I don't know if Josh Bidwell ever had a scholarship, but he sure deserved one.

That dude was a beast of a punter, and kept OBD in a few games with great punts when the offense was stagnant.

 

I believe he even made a few TD saving tackles, if memory serves.

[Charles Fischer]

On 12/24/2021 at 2:50 PM, Wood Duck said:

Josh Bidwell ever had a scholarship, but he sure deserved one.

 

Oh yes he did.  Big dude, too.  Big-time nine-year punter in the NFL for nine years with a 42.7 yard average.  When a placekicker went down...Bellotti asked him if he knew how to kick a field goal.  He lied and said, "yes," and Coach put him in there and he kicked it through!  Had a 46 yard punting average his senior year in 1998...