Fan Emotions?

[Haywarduck]

The question I have is, what can we, fairly, compare fan emotions to? Based on that understanding, what is the corollary?

 

Fans emotions toward players can be like our emotions toward our children. I have a son who is extremely gifted and another who, I would like to call, delayed athletically.  I equate how I view my two sons with how I view the duck players. I think, on FishDuck, this can be justified. We don't criticize the players, just their play.

 

What is the outcome of this emotional attachment? If we look at the players as we would, should our children then we can accept their limitations. We can revel in the small victories and even losses as we know and appreciate they are growing. We can also constructively criticize, hopefully with a positive outcome.

 

What if we ramp up the emotions on the players, like to a little league parent level, and have even more emotional connection towards the football players. We then become less accepting of their limitations, struggles and just look toward outcomes. The process is lost and we just focus on did we win or lose. Their failures directly affect us and we act out based on those outcomes.

 

The first outlook leads to a healthy fan outcome, win or lose. The second outlook is a truly zero sum game where winning is the only thing important, not a healthy outlook. Does anyone else look at being a fan like this? Maybe I am just getting too philosophical about something we should just react to.

[BigDog]

I love the way you shared this. I would hope that we can set aside our emotions when they begin to our behavior in a negative manner. Sadly collage football has become consumed with the almighty dollar and all that goes with it (example 2). While expecting the fans to  maintain its passion and support with patients and compassion. (example 1). I guess you could say it's like having your pie and eating it to. 

 

With things around us as crazy as they are it is easy to view life, including OBD, through the lens of frustration, resentment hopelessness. However, choosing to follow OBD for the love of the game, special memories and the hope to for a special moment or season, will lead to a more fulfilling experience and lower blood pressure. 

 

I haven't done a good job at this but I'm trying maintain the correct focus and attitude because if I don't I would quit watching or caring about OBD... I don't want to throw that away.

[EzDucksIt]

Hayward, I had to look up the word corollary.   Which is great because I learned a new word.  Now I know what it means.  Many a times, watching the ducks play this year, I thought I was having a corollary but NOW, I know that should have been a coronary.  Thank GOD, I looked it up.  I have been guided by Charles in a lot of my previous posts and his help, guidance has been so helpful.  Guidance to not vent but to articulate in a mature manner how we see a team we love grow, develop and have issues with students, coaches and being out played.

 

I do not wish to be that parent, that screams bloody murder about tackling or jarring the football from that other pee wee player for the video to be placed on you tube glory!  That sees the action on the field from green and yellow tinted glasses while holding a blind mans cane.  I want to be entertained by beautiful passes, runs and catches.  Lazer guided tackles, sure handed ballerina moves and sideline catches.  Fast running, sharp cuts and runaway speed to the goal line plays that makes one go WHOA!

 

These Ducks, when they are in synch are a pleasure to watch.  When those games happen, they are untouchable.  I remember three games where the JUICE was so exciting, @Stanford against Luck, @USC against Barkley and at the Rose Bowl against FSU and Winston.  Love these Duck moments, just looking for more and the high that comes from these memorable moments.  One day, Oregon will legalize these highs and we can bring it out for ALL to enjoy too.

[HappyToBeADuck]

Haywardduck

 

Wow.........

 

A lot to digest on this topic..........

 

Warning, if you don't want to be bored, stop reading here. NOW.

 

Some OBD members, including myself, will burn many a brain cell on this, for sure.

 

Not only do people come in different shapes and sizes they come with even more diverse personalities. 

 

I deal, day in with diverse personalities.  I love people so I accept these unique differences in their traits. They were born with their specific DNA and genetic make-up.

 

Personality change is difficult. Takes self awareness, self examination, self discipline and control.

 

Those traits will control how they view anything. And I do not try to change them. Those traits control fan emotions, view points and reactions. Mix in a $150 ticket and booze and view points get skewered.

 

I will not bore everyone, so I will cover just a few of the numerous traits. This is no criticism of anyone. Just generalizations to put your topic in perspective. I won't use clinical terms or base psychological terms. I get $2,500 a day for that.

 

For example:

 

A+ dominant types like General Patton. Win at all costs, always right can take no input. They are never wrong and can't accept how others don't think and act like them. Doesn't matter who gets hurt.

 

Charles and the moderating front seven are ever vigilant toward these types. Thank goodness.

 

They are the parents that storm troop the sidelines yelling and screaming at their kids and coaches. They ruin it for everyone, especially their own child.

 

It's in all sports. They don't care who they hurt. They are always right. Winning is all that matters. I had players who begged me to ban their mom or dad from the games. Or at the least, stop the negative criticism. 

 

There were even violent confrontations with these types.

 

Now you don't have to be A+ dominant to be a fan that wants to just win. 

 

Cheerful, rah rah positive types want to win, too. Cup half full ready to support, no matter the outcome.  Their personality allows them to roll with the mistakes, yet be supportive

Many of these types are nurses who become shift sypetvisors. They rally the troops thru difficult situations. Boost morale.

 

They recognize the growth that is taking place in the player and the team. Any criticism should come from the coaches. 

 

Empath personalities and neutral personalities may want to win, too. But not at the expense of hurting anyone. Not the kids or coaches. They want all the players to be recognized for their efforts. No player criticism on performance. Participation trophies for all.

 

To them, this is just a game, a game played for fun. Just another stepping stone in building character.  Win or lose, each path when handled correctly is a learning opportunity.

 

I can't speak for anyone else on their personality traits and how they view handling their emotions.  Or how they view a game.

 

For me I am the rah rah, super salesman type. Building self confidence and teamwork are the goals. Winning just follows when you believe in the players more than they believe in themselves.

 

Set them up to succeed, don't tear them down to fail. No good ever comes from degrading anyone.

 

Sorry to bore everyone.

 

A few days ago on this forum someone started a topic with a video of a Duck presser at the Alamo Bowl. James Crepea was asking questions to JM and AB. One of the questions was about player criticism.

 

AB took it in stride as a player and a man.  If you didn't hear the hurt in his voice and the pain in his eyes,

well...........

[Haywarduck]

On 12/28/2021 at 6:10 PM, HappyToBeADuck said:

 

Personality change is difficult. Takes self awareness, self examination, self discipline and control.

 

Those traits will control how they view anything. And I do not try to change them. Those traits control fan emotions, view points and reactions. 

 

I have never tried to change anyone, but I am continually trying to shift people. I don't completely agree those traits control them, that is an excuse. A wily question, statement, or shared experience can do the trick to bring on that awareness.

 

Agree the ability to control is limited when booze is added. That is why Charles ask that you not drink and post. 

[Grandpa Duck]

Hayward, I suspect there are more than a few Duck fans with emotions displayed toward players in a manner you find abhorrent.  Even worse than your little league parents, far worse.  

 

From before Autzen opened until the second year alcohol was served there, I had reserved seats, the last nearly 50 years in the donor section.  Parking pass, tailgate in the grass at the northeast corner where there used to be cable TV connections, the whole deal on game days.  
 

We and the rest of our group planned our lives around the Duck football schedule.  Not anymore.  Maybe it’s age, but the behaviors of many Duck fans is such that I don’t want to be anywhere near them.  
 

It didn’t use to be that way.  But, neither you nor I will be able to silence the negative screamers.

 

My refuge is being a TV fan.  I have tried going back to Autzen.  It will never be what it was, and the bad fan emotional behavior is a huge part of why it changed.

[1Funduck]

Haywarduck;

 

My fellow fan. You mention a point of view that touches me as a Grandpa. One day my grandchild will display his efforts in any given task at school and I will be there to root him on. I'll be first in line for the recorder presentation. I'll take off work for all the graduations. I'll enjoy imparting my experiences in life to any willing ear. After all, my grandchild is learning in life, and family should be there at every turn. But there comes a time in life when we are held accountable for our actions.

 

This isn't an angry point of view, nor is it some demented viewpoint where winning is everything, because it's not. Children are required by law to get a 10th grade education. They are also not even close to developed mentally, emotionally, or physically. Up to this point, they have had little choice in life about their life. But, by the age of 18 they have a choice to make. Do you wish to lend your talents to a school in exchange for a full ride education? The cash value is somewhere in the vicinity of $40,000.00 per year. $200,000.00 for the full ride scholarship is the payment for bringing this kids services to the great school of Oregon for 5 years. This is a choice. His choice. 

 

To accost a student athlete is not right. To accost anyone is not right. But, that's not what anyone here is doing. I would like to think that everyone who has an opinion about the abilities of any said player can express them at will. So far, I have seen, read, or heard no reason to think that Anthony Brown isn't a fine human being. An excellent man is a phrase that comes to mind. I do not know him. But, he seems to be gracious and polite.

 

He clearly has his team behind him. But, Anthony Brown entered the real world where life has consequences for your actions/abilities. He's getting 'paid' to play. If he can't meet the challenge then what are the consequences? Let me ask it a different way. If you hire me to mow the grass and I struggle to mow it all each week, would you be concerned about my feelings? 2 out of 4 time a month I mow it real well, even very acceptable in your eyes, but two of those weeks I don't.

 

Do you keep paying me? But, you had an important dinner party at your house and I mowed your lawn but it was substandard, I missed around the side but nobody goes back there anyway.  Your clients didn't notice because they were a bit inebriated. You still won the contract. How much longer do we take a chance that my skills that I brought to your house are going to cost you?

 

Is this unfair criticism? No. It's life. Nobody said I was going to be a great yard guy. There is always someone else who can do better. The choice you have is, do you continue to 'pay' for someone's services that you can't trust, or do you try his competition? The beauty of Anthony Browns situation is that he doesn't lose his job. He's still getting paid to be on the roster. Calling the man names is wrong.

 

But questioning his talents is another and especially since he's getting paid. Oregon invested money into the abilities of AB, so did I. I'm his boss. I buy the ticket. When I see a glaring  weakness then I get to mention it. Same goes true when I see extraordinary play then I mention that as well. I'm an equal opportunity mentioned of ones abilities to play. 

 

I don't see it as mean spirited or anything resembling it. It's not elementary school any more. You want to get paid? You better bring a game worth paying to watch.

[Haywarduck]

Interestingly I fired my son from mowing my lawn and told him to get a job. I totally agree constructive criticism and tough love are an important element of mentorship.

 

The problem I see is we don't know all that is going into the mowing of the lawn in the Oregon Football Program. All we know is a young man is doing his best. We don't have to like it, nor do we have to pay for it. The real problem is Cristobal hired him, trained him and gave him the mower that really seems to be the defective component. 

 

Justin could have mowed the lawn in half the time if Cristobal had let him use the lawnmower he could handle. Did we criticize Justin because he wasn't allowed to do what he could? I just see the criticism as misplaced, not over the top. 

[1Funduck]

On 12/29/2021 at 6:00 AM, Haywarduck said:

I just see the criticism as misplaced, not over the top

 

The beauty of writing. Thx for the reply HD. This is why I love coming here. Express your POV and have a civil yet spirited discussion. I will agree, how the coaches handled the offense over the last few years is a head scratcher at best. Our production slips over that time and one should be looking at the Coaches. Coaches develop players by identifying strengths and weaknesses. For example, if a kid is recruited to Oregon as a mid distance runner, but once arriving here is found out that he excels at long distance but never really tried it, then do we slate him in the 400m? Coaching can ruin an athlete.

 

But the athlete has a responsibility as well. That said athlete has limitations that are exposed through practice and the season. If the athlete keeps making poor decisions, regardless of reason, then the Coaches have to make the hard decision to put the team first and reassign the athlete. 

 

I believe there is criticism to go around with our offensive play this year. In actuality, it's a 3-4 year sampling that has been adding pressure and finally come to the top of everyone's attention only after MC left. We saw the product but were hopeful with the high quality roster. And, maybe that is the rub. We have never had such talent on our roster, never. But, this roster was set up for power. It's not set up for stellar offensive numbers, at least not yet. I loved seeing the transformation and didn't second guess it even last year with a bizarre back door entry into the PAC championship game.

 

But, this year saw a roster that was primed with enough experience and talent that everyone expected a reasonable run for the PAC. But, every game seemed to be too much of a struggle. Stony Brook was an eye opener. Fresno State I was shaking my head in the 4th quarter. tOSU was a beautiful game top to bottom with only one seeming weakness. I truly believed we were going to lose that game by 10+ at kickoff. Then over the next 9 games we saw evidence of weakness spattered through the year.

 

Was it the run game? No. Run game did well until Utah. What is the common denominator? Overthrows, missed open receivers, not throwing receivers open. Maybe this QB play is rooted in poor schemes. I'm not smart enough to identify a team in such depth. But when the play breaks down or a receiver breaks loose, can the QB take advantage?

 

Tonight, I sure hope so. If AB is the talent that some believe he is, then he will tune out the noise and showcase his talents for one of the best interviews for an NFL job. His play depends on it.

[EzDucksIt]

Hayward,

 

What is the problem with the other 3 QB's?  Why can they make plays in practice, we hear about it, but can not perform in a game.  If it is about what they bring to the field, AB has brought the same inconsistencies but at a senior level.  Something is wrong here.  If scoring is an issue, we look at alternatives to score.  We should not be shutting down the offense because it is difficult.

 

And giving the opposing offenses our middle, seems just as insane.  Sure we do not give them the explosion plays but why let them have free rein up the middle.  Things have not been right, it starts with the leadership.  What part of the two Utah games did Oregon show up in?  The Defense sure tried for a bit but when no offense showed up, the defense seem to go MIA.  I do not ever remember when Oregon, with the talent we had and coaches, just laid down.  Except at the game against TCU in the second half.  No accountability.  Failure to rally the team.  Youth, injuries off day for the QB, Leadership. 

 

I hope we find, that we as a team and coaches, make mistakes but learn from them, they make us stronger.  We have faith in the little victories that build experience.  We have instances where we can coach up our players, how to read, react and review to learn what we saw, how we respond and what can be done in the future.  Athletes have a responsibility to become better at their trades, strength, conditioning and study.  Coaches teach technique, concepts why you do what it is you do.  So what really happened.  Mario leaving, may be the best thing that happened for Oregon, sadly, other coaches depended on him for their jobs.

[Log Haulin]

  When a sports team wins a world/national championship there are parades and celebrations. Sometimes there are act of violence, property damage and arson. Wear team colors to the opposing teams stadium and...

 

  When a war or battle is won between nations/tribes there are parades and celebrations. Sometimes there are acts of...

 

  Sports is a microcosm, in many ways, of our society and culture today. It shows the tribalism and maturity, or lack of, at a base level. Scary thought in many ways. 

 

  HTBD commented:

"Personality change is difficult. Takes self awareness, self examination, self discipline and control."

 

  This usually requires motivating factors such as pain and suffering, yet not always. If you are so sucked up over AB or MC that your wife has taken the children and went to the in-laws, you might want to look at that.

 

   I come out of troubled youth, young adult life was even worse with everything you can imagine that comes with it. 9th grade education, jails, streets... you get the Idea. 

 

  At 26 I turned and started walking the other direction. Success and failures along the way. At 52 I have a wonderful wife, my own home, 2 newer vehicles in the drive way and a six fig income. Most important is I am now a value to my family and community. 

 

  This is sports and it is vitally important to a healthy community.  OBDF has found that balance and maturity of being a healthy and enjoyable place to be a fanatic of OBD.  This is valuable and should be protected. We all should be mindful, you never know who is watching.

 

[Haywarduck]

On 12/29/2021 at 6:51 AM, EzDucksIt said:

Hayward,

 

What is the problem with the other 3 QB's?  Why can they make plays in practice, we hear about it, but can not perform in a game.  If it is about what they bring to the field, AB has brought the same inconsistencies but at a senior level.  Something is wrong here. 

As an eternal optimist I don't think there is anything wrong with the other 3 QB's. My bet is they are doing just fine, and their development by Moorhead has kept them at Oregon, along with an amazing sales job by the previous coach. 

 

I think something was wrong here, and what was wrong has left. Mario wanted exactly what we have seen on the field. Moorhead gave him exactly what he asked for and did it very well. My hope is he gets even more out of AB with the ability to innovate, some trick plays. My hope also extends to the idea he will be willing to highlight his back-ups, Moorhead's guys if needed.

 

This is the million dollar question, or 80 million dollar question, which may begin to be answered tonight. Will we see a different dynamic out of a Moorhead offense without oversight?

 

I think this will be the big question both programs will be watching over the next couple years. Was Mario the micromanager, with an over riding conservative bent, along with an extreme deficit in offensive play calling ability? Miami bet big he is actually a genius just waiting for even more talent. My bet is the talent is there, just waiting for the coaches to turn it loose. Should be fun to turn the first page on answering that question, I hope!

[Charles Fischer]

On 12/29/2021 at 8:12 AM, Log Haulin said:

OBDF has found that balance and maturity of being a healthy and enjoyable place to be a fanatic of OBD.  This is valuable and should be protected. We all should be mindful, you never know who is watching.

 

Thank you.  We are not perfect, and in fact will stumble on occasion, but we have established a foundation that works and we will strive to keep it going!