Charles Fischer Administrator No. 1 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Oh brother. I see all the stuff about OSU and WSU wanting to reconstruct the Pac-2 into a PAC-8 or more? Doesn’t that seem weird to you? The Mountain West Conference teams were paid much less on their media contract for a reason. Nobody cares. The remaining two teams of the PAC were rejected by EVERY Power-5 conference, even at a massive discount. Beyond being brutal, it tells them their actual value. Nada. Do they think they are going to combine with proven similarly low value schools, and expect to do better? I think the media companies have shown that not only can you not fool them, but they have thrashed the PAC at every turn. This is harsh, but has anyone else thought about the folly of their upcoming endeavor? 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
1Ducker1 No. 2 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Its the old but true story, to make $$$$ you have to spend $$$--Beavs and Cougs rode the coat tail of USC UCLA Oregon Stanford and Washington till it was over. Sad but True. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Marsh No. 3 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Right now I think OSU and WSU are hoping that rebuilding the pac-12 means they get to keep the "autonomous" or power status. They won't... the other four won't let them. With autonomous status they would get access to the playoff by being a well ranked conference champion. But I don't see the B1G, SEC, big 12 and ACC going for that. At best they keep the brand... but it's a brand everyone knows is toast. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryProf No. 4 Share Posted September 16, 2023 I think it's folly, but I don't blame them. When you have something very good taken away from you, you fight to get it back........ even if it doesn't make sense. And then, when you realize it's not going to happen, you pick up the pieces and move on. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Hilarius Moderator No. 5 Share Posted September 16, 2023 It really depends on the current state of the Pac’s books. The Pac could conceivably have assets that would make it more lucrative for some Mountain West teams to join the Pac rather than the other way around. Granted, they would still drop to G5, but if they grabbed the better MW teams they would surely get a better TV deal than the MW. This scenario would be my preference. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph No. 6 Share Posted September 16, 2023 The Pac-12 should file a Chapter 7 liquidation. As part of the liquidation plan, give OSU and WSU the Pac-12 trademark and give the 2 a bigger piece of the assets after liabilities are paid off, including a Comcast suit asset that should be filed against Larry. The lawsuit the left-behind schools filed should have been settled via negotiation/mediation. But I have zero beef with the 2 left-behind schools filing the same. It's interesting that on the way out the door, the Pac-10 setting sail schools could be leaving 2 NY6 games money behind. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph No. 7 Share Posted September 16, 2023 On 9/15/2023 at 9:16 PM, David Marsh said: Right now I think OSU and WSU are hoping that rebuilding the pac-12 means they get to keep the "autonomous" or power status. They won't... the other four won't let them. With autonomous status they would get access to the playoff by being a well ranked conference champion. But I don't see the B1G, SEC, big 12 and ACC going for that. At best they keep the brand... but it's a brand everyone knows is toast. Absolutely! Maybe via litigation, the Pac-2 hangs in for the playoff through 2026 but after that? Sayonara. What really stinks is that the 2 left behind draw more fans and are better programs than a number of B12 programs. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Author Administrator No. 8 Share Posted September 16, 2023 On 9/15/2023 at 6:16 PM, David Marsh said: Right now I think OSU and WSU are hoping that rebuilding the pac-12 means they get to keep the "autonomous" or power status. They won't... the other four won't let them. Precisely. 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babyjesus615 No. 9 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Wouldn't surprise me if the end-game for these schools is to create enough noise this year to get one of the other power conferences (Big 12 or ACC) to eventually snag them up and end the Greek tragedy of the PAC once and for all. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Marsh No. 10 Share Posted September 16, 2023 On 9/15/2023 at 10:30 PM, Babyjesus615 said: Wouldn't surprise me if the end-game for these schools is to create enough noise this year to get one of the other power conferences (Big 12 or ACC) to eventually snag them up and end the Greek tragedy of the PAC once and for all. That's what they actually want... they can talk about how they want to save the conference but at best they are just saving the name. ACC is probably more likely at this point... as the Big 12 did what their masters wanted and consumed all the programs they wanted.. Colorado, Utah, Arizona and Arizona State. Their media overlords had no interest in Cal and Stanford which is why they went to the ACC... and no one has shown any interest in WSU and OSU which is why they are discarded. Other programs will be discarded soon enough as well, we are still only at the beginning of this process it feels like or maybe just at act 2 of a five act play... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatOrlando No. 11 Share Posted September 16, 2023 When you have no other options and are backed into the corner of irrelevancy, get as much attention as possible. Two years down the road, nobody is gonna give any attention to this story. Best case scenario is the Beavers or Cougars have UCF, Cincy, Houston, Boise, or TCU(before getting into the Big 12) success. Maybe then the Big 12 might take a second look at them when their next television deal comes up. The Big 12, and ACC will be fighting to stay alive. Both conferences know they are gonna be well below the SEC and B1G conferences. The ACC has members both those leagues may want to round out at 20 teams. Clemson, FSU, North Carolina, Virginia, and Miami are likely targets. It will then be a battle between the ACC/Big 12 for schools like West Virginia, Cincy, Pitt, VT, UCF, GT, NCSU. Then you'll need to fill in for losses to get to 20 teams. Those slots will likely go to teams like Memphis, USF, SDSU, Boise, Oregon State and Washington State. Best case scenario for the sport is four leagues consisting of twenty teams. Plus Notre Dame getting their unicorn spot. Frankly I'm done hearing about Notre Dame joining a league at this point. If they ever do, it will be the B1G. But twenty team leagues are coming, and the B1G will likely only wait for them up to a certain point. Then it's likely they'll just grab UNC and FSU to have teams in every corner of the country. The SEC will grab Clemson, Miami, Virginia and maybe Virginia Tech. Then maybe Oregon State and Washington State can go to the Big 12 or ACC. Depending on whomever gets Pitt, West Virginia, Louisville, Cincy and UCF. The Beavers and Cougars are definitely worthy of being one of the 80 teams in my projection. Then let all this conference alignment stuff go away for a while. All leagues can have 10 game conference slates, and the eventual 16 team playoff can be settled where the P4 champions get top 4 seeds, the G5 can have a representative, and the remaining eleven at large spots can go to primarily B1G/SEC members. The ACC/Big 12 will likely get a couple at large spots as well. Then we can all argue over who should get in, instead of arguing who is gonna go to whatever conference next. A much better discussion imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Washington Waddler Moderator No. 12 Share Posted September 16, 2023 Side-stepping the issue of schools and their level of play, I don’t object to some form of a Pacific conference maintaining an identity because somewhere down the road when a combination of unsustainable cable revenue outlay, and pacific coast university Title 9/non-revenue program travel costs put athletic departments into a chronic tail spin, then regionalism will reassert itself as the only sane answer to all this current, unrealistic nonsense. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Marsh No. 13 Share Posted September 16, 2023 On 9/16/2023 at 8:57 AM, GatOrlando said: When you have no other options and are backed into the corner of irrelevancy, get as much attention as possible. Two years down the road, nobody is gonna give any attention to this story. Best case scenario is the Beavers or Cougars have UCF, Cincy, Houston, Boise, or TCU(before getting into the Big 12) success. Maybe then the Big 12 might take a second look at them when their next television deal comes up. The Big 12, and ACC will be fighting to stay alive. Both conferences know they are gonna be well below the SEC and B1G conferences. The ACC has members both those leagues may want to round out at 20 teams. Clemson, FSU, North Carolina, Virginia, and Miami are likely targets. It will then be a battle between the ACC/Big 12 for schools like West Virginia, Cincy, Pitt, VT, UCF, GT, NCSU. Then you'll need to fill in for losses to get to 20 teams. Those slots will likely go to teams like Memphis, USF, SDSU, Boise, Oregon State and Washington State. Best case scenario for the sport is four leagues consisting of twenty teams. Plus Notre Dame getting their unicorn spot. Frankly I'm done hearing about Notre Dame joining a league at this point. If they ever do, it will be the B1G. But twenty team leagues are coming, and the B1G will likely only wait for them up to a certain point. Then it's likely they'll just grab UNC and FSU to have teams in every corner of the country. The SEC will grab Clemson, Miami, Virginia and maybe Virginia Tech. Then maybe Oregon State and Washington State can go to the Big 12 or ACC. Depending on whomever gets Pitt, West Virginia, Louisville, Cincy and UCF. The Beavers and Cougars are definitely worthy of being one of the 80 teams in my projection. Then let all this conference alignment stuff go away for a while. All leagues can have 10 game conference slates, and the eventual 16 team playoff can be settled where the P4 champions get top 4 seeds, the G5 can have a representative, and the remaining eleven at large spots can go to primarily B1G/SEC members. The ACC/Big 12 will likely get a couple at large spots as well. Then we can all argue over who should get in, instead of arguing who is gonna go to whatever conference next. A much better discussion imo. The Big 12 has been give their role to play and accepted it... they are a tier 2 conference. They lack any of the big blue blood major brands and have a bunch of good but not great teams. They will be included for the playoff but it will be a long shot if the conference can ever win one. The ACC is currently a mix of a tier 1 and tier 2 conference .... they still have their big brands but they are feeling the pressures and they won't last long. The ACC Is Next on the Chopping Block for Conference Realignment FISHDUCK.COM Last year I wrote an article about the Coming College Football Schism where there will be two conferences... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
1Ducker1 No. 14 Share Posted September 16, 2023 On 9/16/2023 at 9:36 AM, Washington Waddler said: Side-stepping the issue of schools and their level of play, I don’t object to some form of a Pacific conference maintaining an identity because somewhere down the road when a combination of unsustainable cable revenue outlay, and pacific coast university Title 9/non-revenue program travel costs put athletic departments into a chronic tail spin, then regionalism will reassert itself as the only sane answer to all this current, unrealistic nonsense. Pretty much what David Shaw said. Maybe 10 years down the road but I think it will come back to bite itself in the tail. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven A Moderator No. 15 Share Posted September 16, 2023 If OSU and WSU are the Pac 2, they get all of the assets minus liabilities. That could be tens of millions each. Then, inviting teams to join the new Pac, they do not need to share their windfall. After that, depending upon what teams they snag, their new media deal would probably exceed the Mountain West and/or the AAC. Short term gain. Then when the new crap hits the fan around 2030, they may be invited to join the big boys. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Marsh No. 16 Share Posted September 16, 2023 On 9/16/2023 at 4:19 PM, Steven A said: If OSU and WSU are the Pac 2, they get all of the assets minus liabilities. That could be tens of millions each. Then, inviting teams to join the new Pac, they do not need to share their windfall. After that, depending upon what teams they snag, their new media deal would probably exceed the Mountain West and/or the AAC. Short term gain. Then when the new crap hits the fan around 2030, they may be invited to join the big boys. Canzano had a proposal for what OSU and WSU may want to do for a year... keep the conference at two and do a home and home series with each other and then scramble and pick up 5 other non-conference games. They get to live off the leftover fat of the of conference for a year while setting up who to bring into the conference for 2025 and beyond. I get some of the logic... but I feel that it is pretty pathetic and sad and everyone is going to see it that way. If they do pursue this too that schedule they are going to have it going to be so bad that even if one goes undefeated they'll not get a playoff invite. It'll welcome ridicule. Also... other thought... if we do see a conference de-alignment happen where a Pacific coast conference reemerges with all the classical powers and the pac-12 is still around though as efficiently a G5 conference... would Oregon, Washington, Stanford, Cal, USC and UCLA join a lesser pac-12 or create a new conference of real power teams? Yeah... they'll be making a new conference if that scenario comes to pass and OSU and WSU may be left out again. Let the pac-12 die for now so it may be reborn later. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Duck No. 17 Share Posted September 17, 2023 If desperation and insecurity were attractive qualities, OSU & WSU would be smokin' hot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioDuck No. 18 Share Posted September 17, 2023 On 9/15/2023 at 10:42 PM, Jon Joseph said: Absolutely! Maybe via litigation, the Pac-2 hangs in for the playoff through 2026 but after that? Sayonara. What really stinks is that the 2 left behind draw more fans and are better programs than a number of B12 programs. Yeah, if an alien arrived here and watched college football knowing nothing else but how the teams were playing, would they believe that the PAC is the conference that is in its last season? It's not much of a stretch now to say the PAC is the best football conference in the country this year. How ironic. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckFan93 No. 19 Share Posted September 17, 2023 (edited) On 9/16/2023 at 4:19 PM, Steven A said: If OSU and WSU are the Pac 2, they get all of the assets minus liabilities. That could be tens of millions each. Then, inviting teams to join the new Pac, they do not need to share their windfall. After that, depending upon what teams they snag, their new media deal would probably exceed the Mountain West and/or the AAC. I think this makes the most sense than them joining the MW. Pac2 should have some millions left after this year. They had 42M left after last year according to Jon Wilner... They can recruit the best MW teams to move to the new PAC. The problem is that MW schools have to pay a hefty 17M exit fee if they give 1 year notice, 34M if less. Noboby there can afford that. So OSU/WSU are indeed in deep water next year. Unless they both shine this year and get invited by one of the Power-4, they may not be able to play enough games next year. Oh how would the Beavs pay for that shiny new stadium remodel. Talk about terrible timing! Edited September 17, 2023 by DuckFan93 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OregonDucks No. 20 Share Posted September 17, 2023 (edited) On 9/16/2023 at 8:24 PM, OhioDuck said: Yeah, if an alien arrived here and watched college football knowing nothing else but how the teams were playing, would they believe that the PAC is the conference that is in its last season? It's not much of a stretch now to say the PAC is the best football conference in the country this year. How ironic. And if it weren’t for the defections, starting with the LA schools, imagine the media deal the PAC-12 could get starting next season… Edited September 17, 2023 by OregonDucks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
