FishDuck Article Administrator No. 1 Share Posted November 17, 2023 I know…the title is crazy talk. But is it really? Let’s take a look at the big picture, while acknowledging that the full canvas of this season is incomplete before final judgments are made of Oregon’s offensive coordinator Will Stein. Being student of the glory offensive era for Oregon, (2010-2015) has made me look at this year with a different ... Is Will Stein Better Than OCs Chip, Helfrich & Frost? FISHDUCK.COM I know…the title is crazy talk. But is it really? Let's take a look at the big picture, while acknowledging that the full canvas of this... 4 1 2 Two Sites: FishDuck and the Our Beloved Ducks forum, The only "Forum with Decorum!" And All-Volunteer? What a wonderful community of Duck fans! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyToBeADuck No. 2 Share Posted November 17, 2023 Great in depth article Charles! So much info, coupled with facts, to digest in a few readings. Well done! Who is the best OC? Defenses were not prepared for the schemes and tempos of CK/MH. Most defenses lacked the freaks and depth to go 60 minutes. tOSU, BSU and Stanford did and they bullied the Ducks O line. While their offenses used time consuming drives that kept the Ducks O on the sidelines. Difficult to not have CK/MH at the top. However, defenses are equipped for schemes and mixed tempos in this era. WS has a more complete team of talent to work with. Plus, depth. WS's schemes provide the QB with multiple options within each formation. The QB progression reads, decision making and execution are critical. QB audibles, when needed, are also critical to each plays success. Bo Nix is a special QB that works WS's offense to near perfection. I attribute Bo's slowing of the offense to many of the procedure penalties by the O. Big boys can only hold their water for so long. Does the 6th year senior QB make WS look good? Bo helps but its a team effort couple with the OC. WS can move to the top of the list once his sample size grows over the next few seasons. As long as the next QB can read the D, go thru progressions and execute. He must lead this offense....... Go Ducks....beat ASU..... 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Log Haulin No. 3 Share Posted November 17, 2023 Gotta beat Washington and Oregon State to even be considered. WS is 0-1 with a shot at OSU in a week. Imo, it's just to early to tell where WS is in OC historical rankings on the Ducks. That said, man the Ducks offense looks great. Recruiting is through the roof. The transfer portal, something these other OCs didn't have access to, is being worked masterfully. WS has an elite OL, RB room, WR room and one of the best players in the game at QB. Also something these other OCs didn't have. If WS continues to work the recruiting and TP at an elite level and dominates B1G defenses. Develops an elite QB then yea, he will be the best OC in UofO history. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 4 Share Posted November 17, 2023 (edited) Will Ucla hire Stein? They need the next new thing and to stop with the good ole BS of "getting an established head coach." That line if thinking gets Oregon Wilcox. Will Ucla have the gumption to make a smart move? Gotta at least kick the tires. Edited November 17, 2023 by Darren Perkins 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElPatoUO No. 5 Share Posted November 17, 2023 (edited) Yeah, next season will be the real test for Will (without Bo running things). Not a lot to complain about so far. Edited November 17, 2023 by ElPatoUO Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Log Haulin No. 6 Share Posted November 17, 2023 On 11/17/2023 at 7:15 AM, Darren Perkins said: Will Ucla hire Stein? They need the next new thing and to stop with the good ole BS of "getting an established head coach." That line if thinking gets Oregon Wilcox. Will Ucla have the gumption to make a smart move? Gotta at least kick the tires. I think Stein will lean heavily on the opinions of his boss. I don't know what Lanning opinion is on this. But I can look at his track taken to get to Oregon. What Dan did was become an elite DC first. As a result he was offered a top 10 job. I hope that is considered before he pulls a Dilly. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElPatoUO No. 7 Share Posted November 17, 2023 On 11/17/2023 at 7:15 AM, Darren Perkins said: Will Ucla hire Stein? Stein doesn't have anywhere close to the experience that Dillingham did. This is literally Stein's first season in college football running an offense by himself. He was co-OC at UTSA for 1 season. In his one season running things by himself at Oregon, he has the most experienced QB in the history of college football at the controls. I don't even know how good of a recruiter he is. It is the defensive side of the ball that is killing it in recruiting. I'm not being negative about Stein, he is just too much of an unknown at this point. Any AD of a major program that would seriously consider hiring Stein at this point should be fired for malpractice. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haywarduck Moderator No. 8 Share Posted November 17, 2023 Can he become the best, yes. Does he become the best, I look forward to seeing. As LH stated, you have to beat the rivals, he is 0-1. You have to develop qb's, still seeing that happen. Agree the numbers for offensive output are impressive, but the real impressive numbers come with W's. Right now I am extremely impressed with Stein, but that is like being impressed with Karl Malone for being the third best scorer in NBA history. Few remember Karl because he never won anything. Full disclosure, I watched Karl Malone many times and he was amazing, dominant, but......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph Moderator No. 9 Share Posted November 17, 2023 Thanks, Charles, lots to ponder here. Query: When looking at average points per game, I wonder if Chip, Helfrich, and Frost, had a Corpulent Cupcake Portland State on the schedule? It's not like 38 points in Lubbock, 35 points at Utah, 36 points in Seattle, and 36 at home vs. SC are bad numbers, they're not. But overwhelmingly good? Especially the number vs. USC at home? I think it is a tough standard but also fair to say that many Ducks fans were not pleased with the points put up on defenseless Troy. Especially after the 1st period 2 long TD passes start. It almost seemed as if DL and Stein were willing to play for a 14-17 point lead throughout the game, dink and dunk and run the clock. Although, if this is correct, and it appears to be so after re-watching the game, why go for 2 points after the 1st 2 scores if you don't believe that you will be in a game-long shoot-out? I don't believe the 2 point calls were on Stein but IMO not taking the points early is a continuance of some of this season's baffling O coaching decisions. This is a fun team to watch but is it as good as the efficient, entertaining blur teams that Kelly put on the field? It is not, IMO, as entertaining. Many of the big pass plays this season are dependent on RAC. Bo has a 55% completion percentage on throws of 20+ yards. I see this season's O as an efficient, short-yardage pass, game-control O. When it truly mattered, in Seattle, the O on 2 consecutive plays could not gain short yardage to ice the game. And this was against a UW D that is bad against the run. Will, who is doing a terrific job to date, has the luxury of working with a coach on the field in Bo Nix. I think it will be very interesting next season to see how the O goes without Bo. Meanwhile, Ducks win the next 5 in a row and there will be no debate about the OREGON HOF status of Will or any of the other coaches. First, Go Ducks! Fork the Devils! Thanks again for the thought provoking take. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic No. 10 Share Posted November 17, 2023 On 11/17/2023 at 7:15 AM, Darren Perkins said: Will Ucla hire Stein? Not if Uncle Phil, Rob Mullens and Dan Lanning can help it. (just funnin') Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drake Moderator No. 11 Share Posted November 17, 2023 A top QB certainly helps make a coaches job easier. In my opinion, Mario gets big money from Miami primarily because Justin Herbert had the talent to overcome a very predictable offense. Coach Stein gets attention because Bo Nix is currently killing it. The question I have is can Stein duplicate this level of success with an inexperienced QB? If Stein does that, then he earns a spot amongst the top OC’s in Oregon history. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Administrator No. 12 Share Posted November 17, 2023 On 11/17/2023 at 7:37 AM, ElPatoUO said: I don't even know how good of a recruiter Stein is. It is the defensive side of the ball that is killing it in recruiting. Then you have missed what has been written in the forum many times in the recent past. Stein has recruited three, 4-Star quarterbacks between 2024 and 2025, and this was done last spring and summer before he ever called a single play at Oregon! That, my friend, is selling in anticipation… 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Administrator No. 13 Share Posted November 17, 2023 While I am not a big Ty Thompson fan, I cannot deny the massive improvement of him on the field this season in his limited opportunities. Doesn’t Stein get credit for that? Everyone, please keep in mind that every play that Coach Stein runs are common in the coaching world. He has no advantage of springing tempo on the opposition, because they are all prepared for it. He does not have the surprise element of his own perfected spread office as Chip Kelly did, because again, his plays are standard ones out there in the football world. He does not have the element of surprise at all, thus his success is that much more remarkable. Greatness and weakness, emerge early, and he is certainly a great example of it. It is not without some growing pains, but again it is growing from a very high level to begin with. I would agree, that having a Bo Nix would make anyone look good, and that next year will be a real test,. But I have seen enough already to be completely confident in knowing that we will still have a very high scoring office. And as a reminder as we will be going into the money portion of the schedule? I do not believe we have seen all of Will Steins surprises yet… 1 1 3 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woundedknees No. 14 Share Posted November 17, 2023 I posit this theorem... could going for 2 actually be a false flag to fool tougher opponents into thinking Oregon failed to learn anything from the heart sundering loss to the booty sniffers? "Enquiring Minds Want To Know..." 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDuck No. 15 Share Posted November 17, 2023 Stein's old boss at UTSA interviewed with Tex A&M yesterday. He has a lot of background in the state of Texas football culture. He may not be a "big enough" name to be offered that job, but doesn't mean some other program might not offer him. If so, the UTSA job would be open. Don't know whom UTSA has on their promotable list, but one probably spent this current season coaching in Eugene. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Fischer Administrator No. 16 Share Posted November 17, 2023 On 11/17/2023 at 9:47 AM, HDuck said: Stein's old boss at UTSA interviewed with Tex A&M yesterday. He has a lot of background in the state of Texas football culture. He may not be a "big enough" name to be offered that job, but doesn't mean some other program might not offer him. If so, the UTSA job would be open. Don't know whom UTSA has on their promotable list, but one probably spent this current season coaching in Eugene. A great example of not settling for less than what he could get in another year or two. Be patient, Coach, Stein! 1 1 Mr. FishDuck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic No. 17 Share Posted November 17, 2023 On 11/17/2023 at 9:43 AM, woundedknees said: I posit this theorem... could going for 2 actually be a false flag to fool tougher opponents into thinking Oregon failed to learn anything from the heart sundering loss to the booty sniffers? "Enquiring Minds Want To Know..." Uhhh... no. But nice try! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Washington Waddler Moderator No. 18 Share Posted November 17, 2023 Great read FD. What separates Stein from Dilly is their preferred method of engagement: what floats their respective boats. What drives Dilly is defensive confusion created by surprise, so his tendency is to always make the first move. Stein, on the other hand, is a chess player. All the moves are on the table; the upper hand is gained by reading his opponent’s use of them and reacting before this happens to himself. On a different note, while we all acknowledge it, we sometimes forget that it’s first the ship all our OCs are guiding, and second, the OC himself that is most important. Oregon creates a successful foundation for all the coaches who come here. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Ducky No. 19 Share Posted November 17, 2023 Stein has Bo, Bucky, James, and great receivers across the field along with a good Oline. Talent that most teams don’t have. So my answer is we don’t know yet and probably never will. If Stein hangs around for a a few more years and does well and if he gets us to the playoffs then maybe just maybe he could be. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EzDucksIt No. 20 Share Posted November 19, 2023 To me, Dan Lanning is already proving to be a LONG TERM Coach. Bellotti, had enough success, that Other Schools scooped up his OC's during his 17 years as the Head Coach of Oregon. His long list of Offensive Coordinators whom saw success, to move on to other programs as OC's of Bigger Programs or as Head Coaches. I expect that with another year, Will Stein starts doing the foundation work for a HC resume, he maybe in a position for a HC position at the Collegiate Level. His need is to learn the operations side of managing and assembling a team. I expect he will certainly be in a position to Lead his own team shortly. Bellotti's success began with Borges to UCLA as OC, Koetter to Boise St as HC, Tedford to Cal as HC, Crowton to LSU as OC, Kelly promoted to HC Oregon then to NFL Philadelphia HC, Helfrich promoted to HC Oregon, Frost promoted to OC Oregon to HC at UCF, Arroyo to UNLV HC and Dillingham to HC ASU. Many have moved on from Oregon after running successful Offenses for the most part. Tedford having one of the more successful tenures as Cal Head Coach elsewhere. Dan Lanning, having never been a Head Coach in a Collegiate setting, is in my opinion, doing a Great Job. In his first Two Years at the Collegiate level, at a Power 5 Program. Pretty Impressive for a guy whose only Coaching Positions was GA or Position Coaches at the collegiate level. Until he became the Defensive Coordinator of Georgia. Pretty impressive, in my opinion. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Duck No. 21 Share Posted November 19, 2023 Who is stronger... Superman or The Hulk. The correct answer is: Yes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph Moderator No. 22 Share Posted November 19, 2023 After easy win at ASU, it's reasonable to ask: Is anyone playing better than Bo Nix and Oregon? THEATHLETIC.COM "If that team runs the table, they deserve that opportunity because that's one of the best football teams I've played in my entire career." 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kamikaze Kid Moderator No. 23 Share Posted November 19, 2023 For an outside the box take, I'd propose that Lanning himself may be the best OC the Ducks have had. Early in his coaching carrier at UO, Lanning said that the offense would be a blend of his, Dilly's and the position coaches concepts. He also said that for years, he and Dilly would bounce ideas off each other to get a better understanding of how an offense or defense would respond to a certain type of play or formation. Lanning said that a better understanding of offensive scheming made him a better defensive coordinator. When Stein took over for Dilly, Lanning said that the offensive scheme already in place would remain in place and Stein would be adding his takes to the mix. Bottom line, this offensive game plan is baked into Lanning's offensive philosophy and will remain regardless of who the offensive coordinator is. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
