FishDuck Article Administrator No. 1 Share Posted November 5 During the offseason of 2024, a repeated theme among college football pundits was wondering how the four new teams from the Pac-12 would respond to the more “physical” nature of B1G football. Mr. FishDuck took some time from his fun at Nomaspin casino to ponder this very interesting midwestern assertion with me. The Pac-12 had always been known as a ... B1G Football: Some Say “Physicality.” I Say “Bad Offense.” | FishDuck FISHDUCK.COM Darren Perkins of FishDuck.com believes that the B1G is not so much a conference of “physicality” as it is “bad offense.” 2 1 4 Two Sites: FishDuck and the Our Beloved Ducks forum, The only "Forum with Decorum!" And All-Volunteer? What a wonderful community of Duck fans! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Autzen Magic No. 2 Share Posted November 5 This article is spot on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyToBeADuck No. 3 Share Posted November 5 Darren, well stated! Prior to this season, in conference games from 21 thru 23 Michigan, tOSU and PSU beat every team in the BiG. Michigan beat tOSU & PSU, while tOSU beat PSU. Conference foes did not field enough offense to beat the top 3 teams. ( May hsve been an upseti in those years but i didn"t find one.) PSU had enough offense to beat every other BIG team but not enough to win against the big 2. Michigan had enough offense, coupled with a great defense to best the Buckeyes. Now the Wolverine offense has no punch and just a good defense. Thus very few, if any upsets in the natural order of the BIG... The fact that OBD's beat the Buckeyes and Wolverines must be troubling to their fans on many levels. The PAC had major upsets every season especially after dark. If your offense sputtered you could lose. The Ducks can lose big games if the offense struggles or becomes one dimensional. Or if the defense can't hold down a high powered offense. However, in the current state of the BIG our OBD's are built to dominate any team that doesn't have a offense thay can score. Because a bad offense will not beat a great offense......except if you play usuck! GO DUCKS...... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeotechDuck No. 4 Share Posted November 5 Great article. On a side note, Oregon is now 10-0 vs the BIG since 2016. 1 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haywarduck Moderator No. 5 Share Posted November 5 I think it is the one time usuc was right, they never should have let Oregon into the BIG. Maybe the top programs should focus on football rather than stickers? 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
30Duck No. 6 Share Posted November 5 Last season Michigan didn't pass very much either. But they went undefeated all the way to the Natty, where they beat UW, a team that could pass, So, 1 dimensional football can win. Indiana is running and passing away from everybody they've played this season, but they haven't played a team as good as Michigan yet. Penn State is 7-1. But that feeble 4 down fail at the end of the game against tOSU says that they're actually closer to the top 3 in the B1G and will be tested by UW this week. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalBear95 No. 7 Share Posted November 5 I sometimes wonder if this is due to the how the weather gets colder as the season progresses. A run heavy game makes a lot of sense if you’re going to play 3-5 games in cold weather. So the back end of the season reverse engineers the offense for the front end of the season even though that style makes no sense for that time period You do see B1G type offenses in the SEC but not at the top of the league (maybe to counter the talent disparity?) and I think that the Southeast climate supports a pass oriented style (or at least one that doesn’t treat passing as a second class citizen). The PAC was the same way and so is the Big XII. Both leagues play in climates that are usually pretty temperate for most of the year (I know Kansas/State and Iowa State can be exceptions but I think (a) not often enough and (b) not to the degree - no pun intended - it would allow them to go against the grain of the predominant style of the league) Or not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArkieDuck No. 8 Share Posted November 5 Indiana's offense is now steller - like Oregon's. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanLduck No. 9 Share Posted November 5 Maybe it's just a down year for great qb's. Seems a lot got drafted last year. To have a great offense, need a great qb. And a good O-line. And good receivers. Oh yeah, a run game too. Like our Ducks! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 10 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 3:30 AM, Autzen Magic said: This article is spot on. That's what I say! lol. thank you. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kamikaze Kid Moderator No. 11 Share Posted November 5 Michigan fan pregame: The Ducks are good but I think our physicality will wear down their finesse. Michigan fan post game: I can't believe they just ran it up the middle for that last touchdown. Why didn't they show us some mercy? 1 3 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 12 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 5:32 AM, GeotechDuck said: Great article. On a side note, Oregon is now 10-0 vs the BIG since 2016. That's pretty telling. And, the 2021 win in shoe was the crown jewel. Pundint: "Oregon will have a hard time against a 'physical' big ten team on the road?" Oh, we sure did. ha! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drake Moderator No. 13 Share Posted November 5 A predictable offense can be stopped. As an example, Oregon fans hated the pistol formation of the MC era, because opposing defenses knew what to expect. tOSU, Michigan, and Penn State have generally ruled the Big for years, without the need to make adjustments to their style of play. This year Oregon is equipped to handle top teams with speed, and size, on both sides of the ball. Having a QB in the thick of the Heisman trophy race gives us the upper hand. I don’t expect to boat race the BIG every year, but with our level of recruiting, we will definitely dominate many BIG teams if they don’t start to adjust their style of play. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 14 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 6:17 AM, Haywarduck said: I think it is the one time usuc was right, they never should have let Oregon into the BIG. Maybe the top programs should focus on football rather than stickers? It's sooooo great they couldn't leave the Ducks behind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 15 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 6:20 AM, 30Duck said: Last season Michigan didn't pass very much either. But they went undefeated all the way to the Natty, where they beat UW, a team that could pass, So, 1 dimensional football can win. Indiana is running and passing away from everybody they've played this season, but they haven't played a team as good as Michigan yet. Penn State is 7-1. But that feeble 4 down fail at the end of the game against tOSU says that they're actually closer to the top 3 in the B1G and will be tested by UW this week. Yes, last year's UM team was a bit of an anomaly in today's football. It was like how the SEC used to win titles with stellar defense and ball control offense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 16 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 9:16 AM, Drake said: A predictable offense can be stopped. As an example, Oregon fans hated the pistol formation of the MC era, because opposing defenses knew what to expect. tOSU, Michigan, and Penn State have generally ruled the Big for years, without the need to make adjustments to their style of play. This year Oregon is equipped to handle top teams with speed, and size, on both sides of the ball. Having a QB in the thick of the Heisman trophy race gives is the upper hand. I don’t expect to boat race the BIG every year, but with our level of recruiting, we will definitely dominate many BIG teams if they don’t start to adjust their style of play. Very true. The Ducks will once again influence their peers style of play. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 17 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 7:16 AM, CalBear95 said: I sometimes wonder if this is due to the how the weather gets colder as the season progresses. A run heavy game makes a lot of sense if you’re going to play 3-5 games in cold weather. So the back end of the season reverse engineers the offense for the front end of the season even though that style makes no sense for that time period You do see B1G type offenses in the SEC but not at the top of the league (maybe to counter the talent disparity?) and I think that the Southeast climate supports a pass oriented style (or at least one that doesn’t treat passing as a second class citizen). The PAC was the same way and so is the Big XII. Both leagues play in climates that are usually pretty temperate for most of the year (I know Kansas/State and Iowa State can be exceptions but I think (a) not often enough and (b) not to the degree - no pun intended - it would allow them to go against the grain of the predominant style of the league) Or not. The cougars up here in eastern washington were a high flying act under Mike Leach, and it get cold as heck up here. Not, sure the cold really hurts passing that much, maybe some, but snow and rain for sure. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 18 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 7:49 AM, ArkieDuck said: Indiana's offense is now steller - like Oregon's. yup, and if they can get past tOSU we will see them in the championship. Of course, against the Buckeyes we'll see if they are contender or pretender. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 19 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 8:43 AM, DanLduck said: Maybe it's just a down year for great qb's. Seems a lot got drafted last year. To have a great offense, need a great qb. And a good O-line. And good receivers. Oh yeah, a run game too. Like our Ducks! Correct! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 20 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 9:03 AM, The Kamikaze Kid said: Michigan fan pregame: The Ducks are good but I think our physicality will wear down their finesse. Michigan fan post game: I can't believe they just ran it up the middle for that last touchdown. Why didn't they show us some mercy? The whole "physicality" thing is so laughable. Ironically, in 2007, we were a finesse team and we boat-raced them 39-7 at the Big House. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JabbaNoBargain No. 21 Share Posted November 5 Most of the B1G is caveman football where #44 is likely to be the best offensive player. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartm25 No. 22 Share Posted November 5 The quote of the decade: "Cristobal took a potential offensive juggernaut with a quarterback (Justin Herbert) who should have been a Heisman Trophy candidate and turned it into the most ordinary, coached down, ho-hum group of boring offensive underachievers ever seen in the Pac-12." Let's see if we can get @Charles Fischer to pin this on the Forum front page. Maybe not since it's in the past, but I'd still be happy to see it there. MC unleashed Justin Herbert in his last year against ASU when the Ducks were down. I forget the exact details, but JH led something like 3 TD drives in the last 7 minutes of the game to come up just short. I've never been so mad at MC than in that moment. MC's burial of JH's potential was criminal. Now he's finally letting loose with Cam Ward. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 23 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 9:50 AM, JabbaNoBargain said: Most of the B1G is caveman football where #44 is likely to be the best offensive player. Hahaha.... yes, the fullback/h-back!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 24 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 9:52 AM, cartm25 said: The quote of the decade: "Cristobal took a potential offensive juggernaut with a quarterback (Justin Herbert) who should have been a Heisman Trophy candidate and turned it into the most ordinary, coached down, ho-hum group of boring offensive underachievers ever seen in the Pac-12." Let's see if we can get @Charles Fischer to pin this on the Forum front page. Maybe not since it's in the past, but I'd still be happy to see it there. MC unleashed Justin Herbert in his last year against ASU when the Ducks were down. I forget the exact details, but JH led something like 3 TD drives in the last 7 minutes of the game to come up just short. I've never been so mad at MC than in that moment. MC's burial of JH's potential was criminal. Now he's finally letting loose with Cam Ward. Yeah, that's the irony, MC has finally seen the light. Problem was ASU scored a lot in the 4th quarter with some Jayden Daniels guy at qb. Who knew! Arizona State 31-28 Oregon (Nov 23, 2019) Final Score - ESPN WWW.ESPN.COM Game summary of the Arizona State Sun Devils vs. Oregon Ducks NCAAF game, final score 31-28, from November 23, 2019 on ESPN. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noDucknewby No. 25 Share Posted November 5 Obviously this is a really good team. This is also a good year to enter the B1G. Michigan, USC and Washington are all down and Maryland, Purdue and Rutgers are just plain bad. Had we played last year's Michigan team in the Big House we may have had our hands full. Let's face it, the B1G top to bottom is not that great this year. Sure there's four solid, perhaps playoff level teams at the top, but that's out of 18 teams. That said, I don't see Michigan and Washington staying down for very long. USuc who knows, but they're in a death spiral for the foreseeable future. My point is that this could be a really tough conference in a year or two, especially if Indiana's run has some longevity. Fortunately we're well positioned going forward and I like our chances. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikethehiker No. 26 Share Posted November 5 Low hanging fruit here, but I think field composition plays a big role in how the game has changed over the past 30 years. Weather used to have a significant impact on grass fields that favored teams with size and the ability to run the ball vertical. Turf will always favor speed and strength and to Darren's point - good offenses. Some in the B1G haven't quite let go of the memories of a pile of young men pushing each other through a sheet of rain, snow, and mud. It won't happen any more. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 27 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 10:23 AM, noDucknewby said: Obviously this is a really good team. This is also a good year to enter the B1G. Michigan, USC and Washington are all down and Maryland, Purdue and Rutgers are just plain bad. Had we played last year's Michigan team in the Big House we may have had our hands full. Let's face it, the B1G top to bottom is not that great this year. Sure there's four solid, perhaps playoff level teams at the top, but that's out of 18 teams. That said, I don't see Michigan and Washington staying down for very long. USuc who knows, but they're in a death spiral for the foreseeable future. My point is that this could be a really tough conference in a year or two, especially if Indiana's run has some longevity. Fortunately we're well positioned going forward and I like our chances. thanks. For sure, those teams will be back. But, just as a whole I believe the whole "physicality" argument against former Pac-12 teams was always a bit silly and time to be put to bed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Duck No. 28 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 6:32 AM, GeotechDuck said: Great article. On a side note, Oregon is now 10-0 vs the BIG since 2016. I've got to admit that I am quite surprised by this stat. It's quite impressive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noDucknewby No. 29 Share Posted November 5 (edited) On 11/5/2024 at 10:30 AM, Darren Perkins said: thanks. For sure, those teams will be back. But, just as a whole I believe the whole "physicality" argument against former Pac-12 teams was always a bit silly and time to be put to bed. Couldn't agree more. Sure if you have a Flintstone offense, the defense stacks the line and it's the proverbial "3 yards and cloud of dust". That couldn't happen in the Pac-12 because you would just get scorched deep all the time. Even going back to Chip's "finesse" teams, you couldn't lead the country in rushing without pushing some people around. Edited November 5 by noDucknewby 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solar No. 30 Share Posted November 5 (edited) Physicality cannot come at the expense of the goal of an offense, which is to score as many points per drive as possible. Physicality for the sake of physicality is just a meat head peeing contest. I appreciated this line as well. It's why there is little to fear from bottom feeder B1G teams: "At least in the Pac-12, teams in the lower half of the conference generally had a puncher’s chance because they were still capable of scoring points. But, in the B1G, that does not seem to be the case." Edited November 5 by Solar Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven A Moderator No. 31 Share Posted November 5 Darren, good observations. I also think a lot of the bad offense can also be blamed on bad coaching. And that might be a result of new coaches in new places. Of course, there is no excuse for sc . . . pass happy first half vs ewe dub's highly rated pass D. Realizing too late to run the damn ball. And Franklin's best player doesn't touch the ball on 1st and goal from the 3. Hey James, check out the replay, I think that is who got you to the 3. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph Moderator No. 32 Share Posted November 5 Where have you gone Hayden Fry, not many Iowa fans remember balls thrown into the sky. Purdue? Didn't Bob Griese and Drew Brees play for U? JT Barrett and CJ Stroud didn't slide while passing tOSU to football pride. Is it Parody or Parity in the B1G? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 33 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 12:12 PM, Solar said: Physicality cannot come at the expense of the goal of an offense, which is to score as many points per drive as possible. Physicality for the sake of physicality is just a meat head peeing contest. I appreciated this line as well. It's why there is little to fear from bottom feeder B1G teams: "At least in the Pac-12, teams in the lower half of the conference generally had a puncher’s chance because they were still capable of scoring points. But, in the B1G, that does not seem to be the case." Yup, Mario ball, the definition of "coaching down" players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 34 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 12:21 PM, Steven A said: Darren, good observations. I also think a lot of the bad offense can also be blamed on bad coaching. And that might be a result of new coaches in new places. Of course, there is no excuse for sc . . . pass happy first half vs ewe dub's highly rated pass D. Realizing too late to run the damn ball. And Franklin's best player doesn't touch the ball on 1st and goal from the 3. Hey James, check out the replay, I think that is who got you to the 3. Yeah, SC and PSU were strategically challenged. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Perkins No. 35 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 1:11 PM, Jon Joseph said: Where have you gone Hayden Fry, not many Iowa fans remember balls thrown into the sky. Purdue? Didn't Bob Griese and Drew Brees play for U? JT Barrett and CJ Stroud didn't slide while passing tOSU to football pride. Is it Parody or Parity in the B1G? Deep. And, good question. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
30Duck No. 36 Share Posted November 5 On 11/5/2024 at 1:11 PM, Jon Joseph said: Is it Parody or Parity in the B1G? So far, parity in the B1G is 3 deep, 4 I guess if Penn State has to be included. SEC has 5, Georgia, Texas, ATM, Tennessee & apparently the winner of Alabama -LSU this Saturday. Michigan & Washington should improve in time for the 16 team format, 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Joseph Moderator No. 37 Share Posted November 6 On 11/5/2024 at 6:07 PM, 30Duck said: So far, parity in the B1G is 3 deep, 4 I guess if Penn State has to be included. SEC has 5, Georgia, Texas, ATM, Tennessee & apparently the winner of Alabama -LSU this Saturday. Michigan & Washington should improve in time for the 16 team format, Great Take, yes. Georgia at Ole Miss should be a PO eliminator. Tennessee has a game to play at UGA, and Texas still has to visit Texas A+M. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
