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FishDuck Article

The Time is Now For a New Quarterback

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With the Oregon offense sputtering in four of its first five games, it would seem that now is the time to usher in one of the young quarterbacks on the roster. Anthony Brown has been sub-par this season. While he managed the game very nicely against Ohio State — his best game by far — he was far from outstanding. ...

 

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The only other game that I really paid attention to Brown was his games last season.  And then he was mostly on target, with a few slightly bad throws on deep balls, but not off by much.  One deep pass was perfect, but got called back on a penalty. 

 

Fast Forward to last game.  He had ONLY ONE accurate pass down the field - to Dye close to the goal line, about a 10 yd pass. 

He had lots of very nice short passes sideways where he led the receivers perfectly, and the one to Pittman was led so nicely that Pittman outran the coverage on the crossing pattern and took it way down the field. 

 

But you take away that one pass, and he only threw for 120 yds.  He MISSED on a half dozen throws that should have been completions. 

 

On top of that, he does the Shough move - pulls it down and runs forward BEFORE there is any pass rush. 

He can't make quick decisions on the read option.  It seems that he predetermines the read instead of reading the defense. 

 

I'm just a fan and I can see all of this.  Brown had his run.  He had his turn.  He got his chance.  He got to play for coming here.  Brown can still do short yardage packages, like he did for the pac12 champ game. 

 

But now it is someone else's turn. This isn't pickup basketball at the YMCA. This is major college football.  Even the Stoneybrook QB was better than Brown. 

 

Seeing a new QB is the ONLY thing I now care about with this team. I can't take it anymore.  It hurts too much. 

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It would seem the offense is in need of some type of major shake up. It seems clear that Verdell is out for significant time, and Brown simply isn't getting it done. Starting a new QB could be just the kick our young team needs. And a bye week before a home game is just the place to do it!

 

Watching that game Saturday, I wondered why we even put receivers in the game?! AB never threw downfield to one!

And what's with the TE's not looking for a pass?! Twice!

 

I've been a a staunch supporter of AB but now is the time to change if ever there was a best time.

 

And it's time to see some serious game planning by the OC. If I can read the play, then it's really bad.

 

Change is needed now. We have become boring to watch.

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On 10/5/2021 at 2:22 AM, oregon112 said:

I'm just a fan and I can see all of this.  Brown had his run.

 

That's it, but is Mario capable of seeing it? I'm thinking that a part of why he might stick with Brown is because Mario would be the last coach to do what the fans are asking, or in this case, begging for. "The coach who listens to the fans will soon be sitting with the fans."

 

He hasn't listened to us so far, why would he now? If the Ducks hadn't beat the Buckeyes, this would be the definition of a mediocre season. If the Ducks had beaten Stanford, the Ducks would still be No.3, and Brown would be entrenched as the starter.

 

Two weeks to get the new QB prepared for a game at home against one of the worst teams in the conference. It makes all the sense in the world. It would be the opposite of a knee jerk reaction, not replacing Brown would be made in defiance.

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Honestly I don't think anyone is looking at the big picture. The Ducks are getting killed in the trenches on both side of the ball. Take a look at the offensive and defensive line play. They are simply being outmuscled and pushed around. This is where the game is won and lost. Stony Brook killed them in the trenches, Stanford killed them in the trenches, Fresno State dominated them in the trenches. I totally don't understand how they held their own against Ohio State in the trenches.

 

Let's face it perhaps Ohio state is really not that good. Wake up Duck fans we are getting killed in the trenches by smaller less talented teams, or perhaps we really just not that good in the trenches? Football is not about one guy it's about a team effort. And right now let's face it the team is playing like garbage.  I'm frustrated as well just looking at the big picture.  Lets go Ducks !!!! Figure it out I'm not turning my back on you that easy !!!

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Brown is a gamer and hats off to him for battling through a number of injuries and winning his first game as a starter vs a top 25 team in Columbus.

 

He is a 50%+ plus passer. Not a passer that will complete 65% to 70% of his passes;  the rate the best CFB QBs throw at today.

 

He is not lacking in receiving targets at WR, TE and RB. His footwork is not good. His launch angle is not good. He runs before he has finished all of his progressions. And he simply is not accurate. On deep balls he is not allowing talented WRs to make a play on the ball.

 

From what we heard the QB competition was extremely close in summer practice. Mario went with the conservative, safe choice. He had a chance to run the clock and get the victory last Saturday and failed. He missed a read in the first half that cost 7 points. 

 

Appreciate your take Better Duck. But Brown is getting ample time to throw the ball. And, Ohio State is not a bad football team. Ohio State is still odds on to win the B1G. This season, the B1G E could well be the toughest division in CFB. It's not like the Oregon D shut down the Bucks O. Joe Moorhead did an excellent job of attacking a weakness in the back of the Ohio State D. Ohio State has made changes. It demoted its DC and changed up the starting personnel. In other words, Ryan Day seeing a weakness did not stand pat, he made necessary changes.

 

Brown has hit his ceiling. The ceiling he had coming into 2021.

 

Ty Thompson has a far greater upside than Brown. Thompson will make rookie mistakes. But he should have the opportunity to make mistakes this season and be prepared to start for 2 more seasons.

 

If there is a problem with execution in any endeavor leaders, in this case coaches, have to address the problem and do what they can to fix the problem.

 

And it could be that part of the below average play on OL is the fault of the leader on the field, the QB?

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On 10/5/2021 at 5:55 AM, Better Duck said:

Honestly I don't think anyone is looking at the big picture. The Ducks are getting killed in the trenches on both side of the ball. Take a look at the offensive and defensive line play. They are simply being outmuscled and pushed around. This is where the game is won and lost. Stony Brook killed them in the trenches, Stanford killed them in the trenches, Fresno State dominated them in the trenches. I totally don't understand how they held their own against Ohio State in the trenches. Let's face it perhaps Ohio state is really not that good. Wake up Duck fans we are getting killed in the trenches by smaller less talented teams, or perhaps we really just not that good in the trenches? Football is not about one guy it's about a team effort. And right now let's face it the team is playing like garbage.I'm frustrated as well just looking at the big picture.Lets go Ducks !!!! Figure it out I'm not turning my back on you that easy !!!

I think the line play has to do with youth.  I think there was only 1 start amongst the O-line last year and last year really did not exist in regard to playing games with the Pac pathetic late start and shortened season.  The D-line has more experience, but again these guys are really just in their 4th game as a unit.  

 

Granted, they have seemed to have played down in 3 of 4 games, but maybe they are who they are in those 3 games and played up in 1.

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On 10/5/2021 at 4:54 AM, DanLduck said:

...

And it's time to see some serious game planning by the OC. If I can read the play, then it's really bad.

 

....

If Moorehead is still in the hospital, it could be a while. 😔

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Great point Annie, how can we change out our qb with our OC in the hospital? I would think the OC would want to be in the new starting qb's ear after each play, if not after each practice set to get him ready. Without the ability to do this it would seem to be prudent to let AB continue.

 

The problem is AB seems to be digressing, or was he reading turf speed and our guys were running at grass speed. AB seemed to overthrow a few which may be been misreading the speed on grass? Maybe I am just making excuses.

 

I agree it would be good to make a move with the bye week and a weak opponent next up. I just don't see it happening without our OC, and without a complete meltdown of our starter. One turnover and a poor QBR in one game probably won't cause Cristobal to act.

 

I do hope we see some action for our back-up because he needs to be ready going forward. An extremely bad game isn't out of the question with how AB has played recently. He could also get injured and we need to have the next man up ready to go.

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I find myself in agreement with those who want to begin the Thompson, Ashford or Butterfield era. Brown was a great replacement for Shough and looked good by comparison. This year, with one exception, Brown has been mediocre against pretty weak opponents. It's time to look to the future and play some of our prized recruits. If they don't some meaningful playing time this year, the transfer portal may be an attractive option. 

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I'm not a super vapid Duck fan that lives and dies for stat's so I haven't took the time to really look at who's playing and whos hurt other than the obvious.  I do wonder WTH happened to the team that played Ohio St? Brown was pretty accurate and as a whole the game plan was solid. 

 

I know for a fact that JM was not there and the center Forsythe didn't play. Those IMO are pretty big. There's so many area's to pass the blame too starting with Browns in accuracy which had nothing to do with JM Or Forsythe not being there. But I do wonder and I've heard that MC has stated that he's never had this many injuries on a team before, if those injuries are much deeper than the mantra "Next Man Up" can handle.

 

Oregon's starting a lot of FR and Soph's so when one of them gets hurt there's a 4-5* player waiting but with little experience. It's learn on the fly. Is MC trying to milk as much out of Brown as he can knowing that TT will be learning on the fly? MC doesn't seem like a gambler so I'll be really surprised if TT starts against Cal. 

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Yep, it's time.  Both Thompson and Butterfield have shown they can throw a lot better.  I can't imagine they'd make RPO reads any worse.  They are the future and this year doesn't feel like the year we'll win it all, build for next year.  Is it the 6th year senior/leadership/calm presence thing?  Great, but it's not working.

 

Too many injuries, especially on D, and the D continues to keep us in games in spite of the injuries.  I think scheme and coaching are the biggest culprits, and discipline.

 

*Scheme...this is on the coaches.  Several people have pointed this out.  The offense has no identity (year 4 for MC) though for the most part, MC lets his DC's do their job and with a a healthy lineup I think DeRuyter will shine.  Offense is a bigger concern

 

*Discipline...this is on the coaches.  Every single incompletion, they make the incomplete symbol (emphatically) as if the crowd and the clock keeper can't see the refs do it.  Every single first down...let the refs make the signal.  Is this the down side of 4 and 5 star recruits?  Too entitled?  I get it on a fumble, everyone is signaling their direction, hopeful.  I can see late in the 4th quarter, you stop them on 4th down and seal the win...nothing wrong with passion and emotion, but after a 12 yard pickup to your own 39 yard line in the 1st quarter, hey that's what a receiver is supposed to do, you haven't won anything yet.  Line up again for the next play, the refs will signal for the first down, that's THEIR job.  Prove me wrong, I know a lot of players do it, but I am going to watch this more.  Do Saban's players do that a lot?  I want to re-watch the Stanford game now and watch their players.  David Shaw is a classy and elite coach.  What would he do with 'Bama level recruiting?

 

*Discipline...this time I'm talking about penalties.  'Nuff said?  Coaches?  Taggart's Ducks were amongst most penalized in the nation, MC emphasized cleaning that up, and we were among the best in the nation a couple years ago...what happened?

 

3 straight recruiting classes at the top of the Pac (never had even one prior) so we have the talent.  Charles nailed it yesterday, MC can recruit, the family culture is awesome, the off-field issues (save for a poor choice with an air soft gun) have been very minimal under MC.  But the X and O stuff needs work, and putting these high caliber freshmen in now, I think is the way to go.  And...MC needs to let Moorhead (hope he is recovered and back soon) have the reigns. 

 

Kill the clock to 2 seconds on every play when you are trying to kill the clock, and no false starts.  Rest of the time?  Feels like it takes 8 years to change a play.  I agree with those who want to see more of the Chip Kelly tempo.  45 points a game should be the minimum goal, especially with this talent.  Sorry, pent up rant.

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I know that it seems like AB is getting credit for his running ability. In reality if you look at his runs there are huge holes for him to advance the ball. I will give credit for him finding those wholes but that’s where it stops. The majority of those yard are attributed to some outstanding blocks by receivers, tight ends, and OL. 

I do believe that the other QBs in the stable could do the same or even better.

 

Time to make the switch.

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My bet is the turnover ratio is what will be the kicker for a qb change. As long as AB takes care of the ball, which isn't guaranteed, he will stay our starter. 

 

When Shough started to cough up the ball more than AB is doing now, is when the change was made last year. 

 

Poor decision making from a veteran may push the dial a bit. Why let a veteran make silly mistakes when a young gun could do the same? The problem is I don't think Cristobal wants to risk putting in a young guy who may make 3 quick picks and blow another game. If AB does it then change will come. Until then we will see the same qb, my best guess.

 

Fans are like kids, we have a much larger tolerance for risk. Why not put the young guy in it will be so much fun!

 

Coaches are like the adult in the room, always thinking about the downside. I am not going to change qb's until I have to!

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On 10/5/2021 at 5:12 AM, 30Duck said:

He hasn't listened to us so far, why would he now?

 

He certainly hasn't listened to me about the offense for the last three years--despite what his mentor and the rest of the "Playoff-3" who win the most do!

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On 10/5/2021 at 5:12 AM, 30Duck said:

 

That's it, but is Mario capable of seeing it? I'm thinking that a part of why he might stick with Brown is because Mario would be the last coach to do what the fans are asking, or in this case, begging for. "The coach who listens to the fans will soon be sitting with the fans."

I want Mario to stay. I don't care if he listens to fans or not, but I'd like him to somehow help us see he is willing to make changes and not be stubborn. 

 

Now is the right time to get the young guys valuable playing time. The next one or two years should prove or disprove Mario's master plan. 😀

 

But the real key is the QB. Always will be.

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On 10/5/2021 at 2:22 AM, oregon112 said:

The only other game that I really paid attention to Brown was his games last season.  And then he was mostly on target, with a few slightly bad throws on deep balls, but not off by much.  One deep pass was perfect, but got called back on a penalty. 

 

Fast Forward to last game.  He had ONLY ONE accurate pass down the field - to Dye close to the goal line, about a 10 yd pass. 

He had lots of very nice short passes sideways where he led the receivers perfectly, and the one to Pittman was led so nicely that Pittman outran the coverage on the crossing pattern and took it way down the field. 

 

But you take away that one pass, and he only threw for 120 yds.  He MISSED on a half dozen throws that should have been completions. 

 

On top of that, he does the Shough move - pulls it down and runs forward BEFORE there is any pass rush. 

He can't make quick decisions on the read option.  It seems that he predetermines the read instead of reading the defense. 

 

I'm just a fan and I can see all of this.  Brown had his run.  He had his turn.  He got his chance.  He got to play for coming here.  Brown can still do short yardage packages, like he did for the pac12 champ game. 

 

But now it is someone else's turn. This isn't pickup basketball at the YMCA. This is major college football.  Even the Stoneybrook QB was better than Brown. 

 

Seeing a new QB is the ONLY thing I now care about with this team. I can't take it anymore.  It hurts too much. 

Yeah, the time is now, or just more of the same.... 

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I'll argue two things.

 

1. I completely understand why the coaches played him to start the season. As bad as some of his reads were against stanford, he has only thrown one INT all season and that is what oregon needed to beat  Ohio state. 

2. With that said we absolutely need a qb change, I can handle Freshman making the mistakes that brown is making but seeing a 6th year senior making the mistakes that he is atrocious. 

 

As a slightly off point but still relevant, I really don't think OC's should be the QB coach as well. I just think there's too much fineese needed in the position to adequately coach QB's and direct an offense. I often think of the high points of the kelly and helfrich era. Because while technically Helfrich was the OC for Oregon he wasn't the play caller and probably had way more time than the average OC to coach his QB's. The same could be said as Helfrich moved over to HC, He became the play caller while frost was the QB coach/OC.

 

As a final point of Dakota Prukop played significantly better through his 4.5 games before getting pulled against washington state. He had a much better completion percentage and a better passer rating. while his TD/INT ratio wasn't amazing it was passable and oregon wasn't losing games due to his capabilities(the defense couldn't stop anything). I have know idea if the freshman are better than brown but at this point they deserve the shot because I will always be willing to lose a game because of a rookie qb vs an old one. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 4:54 AM, DanLduck said:

It would seem the offense is in need of some type of major shake up. It seems clear that Verdell is out for significant time, and Brown simply isn't getting it done. Starting a new QB could be just the kick our young team needs. And a bye week before a home game is just the place to do it!

 

Watching that game Saturday, I wondered why we even put receivers in the game?! AB never threw downfield to one!

And what's with the TE's not looking for a pass?! Twice!

 

I've been a a staunch supporter of AB but now is the time to change if ever there was a best time.

 

And it's time to see some serious game planning by the OC. If I can read the play, then it's really bad.

 

Change is needed now. We have become boring to watch.

 

Yeah, reminds me of being wr in middle school, we nevere threw the ball so it was a pretty boring position to play, are talented receivers are probably beyond frustrated. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 5:12 AM, 30Duck said:

 

That's it, but is Mario capable of seeing it? I'm thinking that a part of why he might stick with Brown is because Mario would be the last coach to do what the fans are asking, or in this case, begging for. "The coach who listens to the fans will soon be sitting with the fans."

 

He hasn't listened to us so far, why would he now? If the Ducks hadn't beat the Buckeyes, this would be the definition of a mediocre season. If the Ducks had beaten Stanford, the Ducks would still be No.3, and Brown would be entrenched as the starter.

 

Two weeks to get the new QB prepared for a game at home against one of the worst teams in the conference. It makes all the sense in the world. It would be the opposite of a knee jerk reaction, not replacing Brown would be made in defiance.

 

Yeah, i was holding out for Brown until now, changed is needed. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 5:55 AM, Better Duck said:

Honestly I don't think anyone is looking at the big picture. The Ducks are getting killed in the trenches on both side of the ball. Take a look at the offensive and defensive line play. They are simply being outmuscled and pushed around. This is where the game is won and lost. Stony Brook killed them in the trenches, Stanford killed them in the trenches, Fresno State dominated them in the trenches. I totally don't understand how they held their own against Ohio State in the trenches.

 

Let's face it perhaps Ohio state is really not that good. Wake up Duck fans we are getting killed in the trenches by smaller less talented teams, or perhaps we really just not that good in the trenches? Football is not about one guy it's about a team effort. And right now let's face it the team is playing like garbage.  I'm frustrated as well just looking at the big picture.  Lets go Ducks !!!! Figure it out I'm not turning my back on you that easy !!!

 

Scheme can also contribute to poor play by all the positions. I the defense knows what is coming and the coaches are not putting the players in the best position to succeed, the coaches lessen the chance of the players playing well. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 7:01 AM, Jon Joseph said:

Brown is a gamer and hats off to him for battling through a number of injuries and winning his first game as a starter vs a top 25 team in Columbus.

 

He is a 50%+ plus passer. Not a passer that will complete 65% to 70% of his passes;  the rate the best CFB QBs throw at today.

 

He is not lacking in receiving targets at WR, TE and RB. His footwork is not good. His launch angle is not good. He runs before he has finished all of his progressions. And he simply is not accurate. On deep balls he is not allowing talented WRs to make a play on the ball.

 

From what we heard the QB competition was extremely close in summer practice. Mario went with the conservative, safe choice. He had a chance to run the clock and get the victory last Saturday and failed. He missed a read in the first half that cost 7 points. 

 

Appreciate your take Better Duck. But Brown is getting ample time to throw the ball. And, Ohio State is not a bad football team. Ohio State is still odds on to win the B1G. This season, the B1G E could well be the toughest division in CFB. It's not like the Oregon D shut down the Bucks O. Joe Moorhead did an excellent job of attacking a weakness in the back of the Ohio State D. Ohio State has made changes. It demoted its DC and changed up the starting personnel. In other words, Ryan Day seeing a weakness did not stand pat, he made necessary changes.

 

Brown has hit his ceiling. The ceiling he had coming into 2021.

 

Ty Thompson has a far greater upside than Brown. Thompson will make rookie mistakes. But he should have the opportunity to make mistakes this season and be prepared to start for 2 more seasons.

 

If there is a problem with execution in any endeavor leaders, in this case coaches, have to address the problem and do what they can to fix the problem.

 

And it could be that part of the below average play on OL is the fault of the leader on the field, the QB?

 

Agree. And I for one was actually thinking they should have gone for 3 at the end of the first half. People tend to underestimate the impact that first half field goals can have later in the game. It's ok to go conservative in a close game with tons of time left. Ducks go for 3 there, they win. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 8:23 AM, Duck 68 said:

I find myself in agreement with those who want to begin the Thompson, Ashford or Butterfield era. Brown was a great replacement for Shough and looked good by comparison. This year, with one exception, Brown has been mediocre against pretty weak opponents. It's time to look to the future and play some of our prized recruits. If they don't some meaningful playing time this year, the transfer portal may be an attractive option. 

 

Totally agree. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 8:24 AM, GODUCKS15 said:

I'm not a super vapid Duck fan that lives and dies for stat's so I haven't took the time to really look at who's playing and whos hurt other than the obvious.  I do wonder WTF happened to the team that played Ohio St? Brown was pretty accurate and as a whole the game plan was solid. 

 

I know for a fact that JM was not there and the center Forsythe didn't play. Those IMO are pretty big. There's so many area's to pass the blame too starting with Browns in accuracy which had nothing to do with JM Or Forsythe not being there. But I do wonder and I've heard that MC has stated that he's never had this many injuries on a team before, if those injuries are much deeper than the mantra "Next Man Up" can handle.

 

Oregon's starting a lot of FR and Soph's so when one of them gets hurt there's a 4-5* player waiting but with little experience. It's learn on the fly. Is MC trying to milk as much out of Brown as he can knowing that TT will be learning on the fly? MC doesn't seem like a gambler so I'll be really surprised if TT starts against Cal. 

 

Good points that are relevant and contributing to our collective frustrations. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 8:37 AM, JDuck said:

Yep, it's time.  Both Thompson and Butterfield have shown they can throw a lot better.  I can't imagine they'd make RPO reads any worse.  They are the future and this year doesn't feel like the year we'll win it all, build for next year.  Is it the 6th year senior/leadership/calm presence thing?  Great, but it's not working.

 

Too many injuries, especially on D, and the D continues to keep us in games in spite of the injuries.  I think scheme and coaching are the biggest culprits, and discipline.

 

*Scheme...this is on the coaches.  Several people have pointed this out.  The offense has no identity (year 4 for MC) though for the most part, MC lets his DC's do their job and with a a healthy lineup I think DeRuyter will shine.  Offense is a bigger concern

 

*Discipline...this is on the coaches.  Every single incompletion, they make the incomplete symbol (emphatically) as if the crowd and the clock keeper can't see the refs do it.  Every single first down...let the refs make the signal.  Is this the down side of 4 and 5 star recruits?  Too entitled?  I get it on a fumble, everyone is signaling their direction, hopeful.  I can see late in the 4th quarter, you stop them on 4th down and seal the win...nothing wrong with passion and emotion, but after a 12 yard pickup to your own 39 yard line in the 1st quarter, hey that's what a receiver is supposed to do, you haven't won anything yet.  Line up again for the next play, the refs will signal for the first down, that's THEIR job.  Prove me wrong, I know a lot of players do it, but I am going to watch this more.  Do Saban's players do that a lot?  I want to re-watch the Stanford game now and watch their players.  David Shaw is a classy and elite coach.  What would he do with 'Bama level recruiting?

 

*Discipline...this time I'm talking about penalties.  'Nuff said?  Coaches?  Taggart's Ducks were amongst most penalized in the nation, MC emphasized cleaning that up, and we were among the best in the nation a couple years ago...what happened?

 

3 straight recruiting classes at the top of the Pac (never had even one prior) so we have the talent.  Charles nailed it yesterday, MC can recruit, the family culture is awesome, the off-field issues (save for a poor choice with an air soft gun) have been very minimal under MC.  But the X and O stuff needs work, and putting these high caliber freshmen in now, I think is the way to go.  And...MC needs to let Moorhead (hope he is recovered and back soon) have the reigns. 

 

Kill the clock to 2 seconds on every play when you are trying to kill the clock, and no false starts.  Rest of the time?  Feels like it takes 8 years to change a play.  I agree with those who want to see more of the Chip Kelly tempo.  45 points a game should be the minimum goal, especially with this talent.  Sorry, pent up rant.

 

Yup, and we're all feeling the pain.... 

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