About Booing: Cristobal Lives in the River City….De-Nile

[FishDuck Article]

Pretty stunning, wasn’t it?  All the booing in Autzen, and over so many plays. This wasn’t about your typical disagreement with the coach over going for it (or not) on 4th down, or an occasional bad play call. This was a venting by the Autzen faithful. Frustrations with Coach Mario Cristobal have been simmering with a minority of fans over ...

 

Read the full article here...

 

[Haywarduck]

I think the booing might work, but not in the way intended. Voting with your pocketbook, on the other hand, is much more effective. 

 

Protesters are often looked upon as rude, disorganized and ineffective. When we boo at Oregon as they win, it may just make us all look bad, as protesters often do. We get bunched into those who step over the line.

 

Much like the picture of Herb Brooks I posted, who coached Team USA in the Olympics, the hate for him provided the energy to the team. They all bound together in their hate of the coach. There are indications the team is doing this right now, with the fans as the hated one. So booing might work, just not as it is meant too, again, much like protesters.

 

In the end the team might win, the coach who we dislike might end up looking good too. This will just promote all the same stuff the booing is intended to change!

 

As far as voting with our pocketbooks this is the most effective way to communicate to the AD. This is actually why we have little power, but the big donors, like the lobbyist in real life, have all the power. We can walk away, and make a ripple in the direction of the team. The big donors, in the end, will have the biggest impact and they aren't blind to what is going on.

 

Basically I am not a big protester, it is mostly just cathartic to the fan, and not the type of emotional relief I look for. I would rather just walk away, and enjoy the many amazing things in life. I also try to reframe what is going on and realize this is just a process we need to appreciate.

 

Bottomline I appreciate student athletes working toward a goal, and I don't appreciate unruly fans acting like they are enabled whiners. We all make choices, this is how I see it.

 

 

 

 

[1Ducker1]

Fans will cheer and fans will boo, its all apart of sports. 

[Duckman]

While booing makes me uncomfortable, I certainly understand the sentiment.  Mr. FD is right.  As Duck fans, we have seen well-coached, well organized, and well-planned offense.  We had become accustomed to excellent QB play.  Under Cristobal, we do not consistently see any of those things.  More often than not, his teams come out flat, disorganized, and tentative.  If not for booing, how does the average fan voice their displeasure?

 

However, stating the obvious, booing is indiscriminate.  Do players and coaches understand what is being booed?  Personnel choices, player mistakes, etc?

 

Fans can obviously vote with their pocketbooks.  As long as the Ducks are winning, Autzen will remain relatively full.  However, that is not guaranteed.  While I am certainly not rooting for it, it seems likely that the Ducks will  drop 2-3 more games unless the QB play improves.  Will the Autzen faithful remain loyal (and willing to pay top dollar) to watch boring football if the team is out of contention?

[Annie]

Booing in Autzen Stadium is nothing new. And the thing is, it doesn't take many people booing for the sound to stand out. When I've been to games where there was booing, I would look around and not be able to see who was booing. It could be 1% of the fans. And there's no way for other fans to show their disapproval of the booing (I'm sure at least some people disapprove). I mean, what do you do--boo the boo-ers? It would just come across as more booing.

I would never boo the coaches or the players. The refs, on the other hand....

 

[joeevan]

Thank you, Charles, for the compelling piece on the current responses from Duck fans. 
 

Not to over-simplify the matter, but Duck fans have two choices: Boo or Boo-hoo.

 

Go, Duck Fans……

[criticalduck]

On 10/18/2021 at 8:06 AM, Annie said:

I would never boo the coaches or the players. The refs, on the other hand...

I have only booed the refs also. I think booing players (from either team) may be excessive. I can see booing coaches though. I agree with Haywarduck that the pocketbook is the best way to vote, ultimately, but if the fans walked out just for one quarter or half turning Autzen into a visiting fan's dream that would also get the point across.

[Vandownbytheriverduck]

Accountability. The games don’t happen without the fan$.
 

Booing displeasure is exactly what is called for when it’s displeasing. It’s neither disrespectful or even unwarranted on many occasions.

 

If the team are such snowflakes as to get upset or undone by booing bad play then there is a far deeper culture problem at Oregon. 

withdrawl symptoms are pretty powerful. MC took away some of our Saturday dopamine fix and replaced it with angst and frustration 

still 5-1 but just not that entertaining a football product as previous iterations. 

[Arctuniol]

I think the booing stems more from the lack of offensive identity, not just directed towards players. The reality is, AB is a decent QB who can dink and dunk 4 yard plays and the playmakers aka Dye make people miss. When it comes to pushing the ball downfield 20 and 30 yard throw and catches, the explosive running plays utilizing the speed of the players. The Duck Offense used to put pressure on other teams to make mistakes on their offense, and alleviate our defense. We are now reliant on a bend don't break defense to keep it close against inferior teams to have a last minute heroic and win.

 

This works against lower tier teams, not upper echelon teams. In Stony Brook, Oregon was barely ahead going into second half, and TT came in and sparked that team for a good offensive output. Arizona, it was just a really bad Arizona team and many turn overs. The last two, Stanford and Cal, the turn overs have been our offense not the other teams. With Ohio State, AB played a great game but Ohio State played a poor game, the difference is, Ohio State has gotten better since then, Oregon has gotten worse.

 

People say oh why did Oregon fall in the polls, well since Ohio State, Oregon has barely scrapped past Stony Brook and Cal, lost to Stanford, and beat Arizon in the last quarter mainly due to great defensive playing. If oregon had crushed the lower tier teams then they would not have fallen, but when you need last second heorics to win against unranked opponents, Oregon will continue to drop in the polls, which is fitting. 

[30Duck]

On 10/18/2021 at 8:00 AM, Duckman said:

More often than not, his teams come out flat, disorganized, and tentative.  If not for booing, how does the average fan voice their displeasure?

 I feel like this is the nexus of Mario's coaching disconnect. His Plan is to be a dominating team, but his play has been anything but that, Personal fouls, more often than not a timeout called before or after the first offensive play. His choice at QB is supposed to be the no fuss, game manager, but AB has a very low ceiling and many obvious flaws.

 

However, Oregon has been successful under Cristobal, With every win he becomes more certain that everything is working fine, a loss just means they have to work harder. The problem is, what are they working at? We recognize a Style of play from every other team in the conference, but Oregon, who a few short years ago was the most recognizable team in the country now looks like something put together on the fly.

 

I've seen reports that Mario was very disturbed by the booing. I understand that. He and his family have bought in to Oregon completely, he bleeds green & yellow, The team is in the top 10. But still something is off, and as long as Mario keeps going like everything is fine, the frustration, and booing, will continue. 

[Jon Joseph]

You pay your money to see the show, you get to boo if you so choose. Far better than TN fans littering the field with garbage, a lot of it aimed at Ole Miss coach Lane Kiffin.

 

When I watch the Ducks this season on the tube I don't boo. But I do from time to time scream at my TV asking the O to run, 'The Other Play.'

 

I watch CFB coast to coast every weekend. Oregon's O is the most predictable, plodding, pedestrian, boring O out there. The O is led by a guy who has been a gutsy but mediocre player his entire CFB career. A guy with no NFL upside; maybe, a chance to play in the CFL?

 

You nailed it Charles. When intelligent people pay good money to watch dreck they are going to, rightfully,  let their feelings be known.

 

If Mullens doesn't see the brand disappearing he's as blind as a bat, without a bat's radar to compensate.

 

I cannot believe the big boosters are not letting Mullens have it?

 

Why pay $1M a year to Moorhead and then not let Moorhead run the O? Why play a 6th year QB with no upside instead of getting experience for one of the young QBs? 

 

Will Ty Thompson's 1st CFB start occur in 2022 in Atlanta vs Georgia? Good luck.

 

Why in 2021 are you running, thank you 30 Duck, a 'prevent offense?' 

 

Finally, why recruit all of the WR talent if you are not going to throw the ball to these guys?

 

And my Ducks brothers and sisters, Mario is not going 'to learn' and play other than smash mouth football. Smash mouth is ingrained in the man's DNA. 

 

Mario has well over 70 games a s a HC. His game preparation and game management is not going to improve.

 

However, Go Ducks. Beat UCLA. You are the conference's best and only playoff hope.

 

We will continue to watch many the 1 score difference game. What I hope we don't see is a whole bunch of talented Ducks flocking to the portal at the end of this season?

 

 

[Charles Fischer]

The most important thing to Cristobal...is "being tough" over everything.  His second biggest value that he promotes is "loyalty" and because he preaches it so strong to the team--he has to stick to Brown. 

 

Cristobal now has to learn how to teach mental strength....to fight through the boos. Can he?  The players have according to articles, but can they do that at every home game?  Because Cristobal is not going to change, thus the reaction of a percentage of fans will not either, and they will boo.

 

Cristobal's reaction?  He is angry because the fans are being disloyal to him....the worst offense we can be guilty of.  (In his value system)  This will have big implications later in the season.

 

I knew a ton of people would disagree with my article--and that's OK.  I wanted to have this discussion, because it will truly be the start of it, the canary-in-the-coal-mine for Mullens and Cristobal.

[Massduck]

All I can say is-Damn Charles, spot on. 

The truth hurts. 
Please send that to Mullens and Cristobal. 

[Charles Fischer]

On 10/18/2021 at 7:13 AM, Haywarduck said:

voting with our pocketbooks this is the most effective way to communicate to the AD.

 

This sounds good and makes sense to most people...but for a 35 year season ticket-holder in Eugene....is it really practical?

 

Once you cancel your tickets....your priority status for getting tickets again when the offense is more entertaining, and for other sports is destroyed.

 

Here is the reality for people like me....we are trapped.  We do not like this product on the field, but have to pay thousands for the tickets to retain our 35 year priority.  In other words...I LOSE NO MATTER WHAT. A boring offense, unentertaining AND I have to pay the money each year.  They bring in a new coach eventually that I want to watch? Back to the 5 yard line again Charles....  (I am on the 35 yard line now)

 

The impact on me is greater than Oregon losing one season ticket holder among 30,000 and thus your suggestion is not as workable as many would think.

 

And that concept of feeling trapped creates even more frustration with the coach...

[Haywarduck]

Here is a quote from a blog I included at the bottom, ' I'm a Cornhusker fan. We don't cheat, we have a great academic record and our kids are generally good folks. These are things to be proud of and the fans should represent Nebraska with that same class.' And I ask, what kind of fans do we want to be and what kind of program? The blog is from the start of Nebraska's over two decades of trying to find the next great coach.

 

The husker nation is thought of as the best, if not one of the best fan bases in all of fandom. They frown on booing, but like most are impatient fans who have grabbed at many different iterations of coaching styles. From Bo Pelini, to awe shucks, and nothing has pleased them.

 

We were fortunate we had a coach with integrity we stood by over 40 years ago. He had recruiting violations and we stayed the course. Over the years he hired guys who built systems and processes which were the foundation of the Oregon Football Program for decades after he left. That was destroyed and we are starting again.

 

I ask who do we want to hire coaches, and build systems and processes going forward? I will also say those systems and processes take time to implement and evolve, like our pistol plunge, thankfully seeing the grave. Do we really want to start over, like so many programs looking for the next Nic Saban?

 

Division 1 football is littered with programs like Nebraska is now. Texas is now just like Tennessee, which is just like Florida State who is like USC. We can be different if we gracefully stand behind a coach with integrity and a vision. 

 

We can be 'the most intelligent fans,' but we can also be the most loyal, classy and understand we need to be part of the long game.  The long game is supporting a coach with integrity, while pointing out weaknesses. That support involves understanding the growth process and it's many stops and starts. Tell me who has had great success among us, without many failures and stumbles? I know for me, my greatest success has come with great struggle, but also with few important supporters.

 

Bottomline I don't want to become an ugly fanbase. I also don't want to become another football program always on the lookout for the next great coach with a quick fix. There are over a 100 of those programs out there with those two traits, and only a few who seem to be stand behind their coaches. I don't want to become just another program, where it seems many have us headed.

 

https://www.huskermax.com/2cents/100707responses5.html

[Annie]

On 10/18/2021 at 9:46 AM, Haywarduck said:

Here is a quote from a blog I included at the bottom, ' I'm a Cornhusker fan. We don't cheat, we have a great academic record and our kids are generally good folks. These are things to be proud of and the fans should represent Nebraska with that same class.' And I ask, what kind of fans do we want to be and what kind of program? The blog is from the start of Nebraska's over two decades of trying to find the next great coach.

 

The husker nation is thought of as the best, if not one of the best fan bases in all of fandom. They frown on booing, but like most are impatient fans who have grabbed at many different iterations of coaching styles. From Bo Pelini, to awe shucks, and nothing has pleased them.

 

We were fortunate we had a coach with integrity we stood by over 40 years ago. He had recruiting violations and we stayed the course. Over the years he hired guys who built systems and processes which were the foundation of the Oregon Football Program for decades after he left. That was destroyed and we are starting again.

 

I ask who do we want to hire coaches, and build systems and processes going forward? I will also say those systems and processes take time to implement and evolve, like our pistol plunge, thankfully seeing the grave. Do we really want to start over, like so many programs looking for the next Nic Saban?

 

Division 1 football is littered with programs like Nebraska is now. Texas is now just like Tennessee, which is just like Florida State who is like USC. We can be different if we gracefully stand behind a coach with integrity and a vision. 

 

We can be 'the most intelligent fans,' but we can also be the most loyal, classy and understand we need to be part of the long game.  The long game is supporting a coach with integrity, while pointing out weaknesses. That support involves understanding the growth process and it's many stops and starts. Tell me who has had great success among us, without many failures and stumbles? I know for me, my greatest success has come with great struggle, but also with few important supporters.

 

Bottomline I don't want to become an ugly fanbase. I also don't want to become another football program always on the lookout for the next great coach with a quick fix. There are over a 100 of those programs out there with those two traits, and only a few who seem to be stand behind their coaches. I don't want to become just another program, where it seems many have us headed.

 

https://www.huskermax.com/2cents/100707responses5.html

 

[Jon Joseph]

Nebraska academics? Nebraska was an AAU member school when it joined the B1G. No longer the case. Only B1G school that is not an AAU member.

 

I was at a game in Lincoln where CU, ultimately beat down by the Ducks in the bowl game, destroyed a Nebraska team that played Miami for the BCS title. I assure you that on that day many the boo was heard from the Cornhusker fans. 

 

Pelini was often booed. Booed out of Lincoln. Frost is the fair haired child but he also is starting to hear it.

 

Nebraska fired a 9+ win a season Frank Solich and has never been the same since. Solich did excellent work in the MAC at Ohio. 

 

Nebraska's AD and HC hires have been on par with those of USC; lousy.

[Haywarduck]

On 10/18/2021 at 9:43 AM, Charles Fischer said:

 

This sounds good and makes sense to most people...but for a 35 year season ticket-holder in Eugene....is it really practical?

 

Once you cancel your tickets....your priority status for getting tickets again when the offense is more entertaining, and for other sports is destroyed.

 

Here is the reality for people like me....we are trapped.  We do not like this product on the field, but have to pay thousands for the tickets to retain our 35 year priority.  In other words...I LOSE NO MATTER WHAT. A boring offense, unentertaining AND I have to pay the money each year.  They bring in a new coach eventually that I want to watch? Back to the 5 yard line again Charles....  (I am on the 35 yard line now)

 

The impact on me is greater than Oregon losing one season ticket holder among 30,000 and thus your suggestion is not as workable as many would think.

 

And that concept of feeling trapped creates even more frustration with the coach...

Like I said, it is the big boys who really are going to hit the AD in the pocket. My point is if you want to protest, don't buy the garb, the food, walk out. Don't allow yourself to be labeled as the lowest denominator in the Oregon fanbase. 

 

I won't get political, but my son went to a protest and I think his experience was telling. He was all fired up, saw all the injustices and wanted to be a bigger part of it. I told him to find the smart people working to make real change, don't get caught up in the craziness of the moment. I think, right now, too many people are getting caught up in the protest, and not really seeing the process which is going to create the change they want or understanding what that process will look like. 

 

Fortunately my son didn't get caught in the protest movement we see on both sides right now, and what I see beginning to happen with Oregon Football. I think we should continue to share ideas on FD and move in a positive real Oregon Fan direction. It all starts and stops with the actions of each of us.

[30Duck]

On 10/18/2021 at 9:46 AM, Haywarduck said:

We can be 'the most intelligent fans,' but we can also be the most loyal, classy and understand we need to be part of the long game.  The long game is supporting a coach with integrity, while pointing out weaknesses. That support involves understanding the growth process and it's many stops and starts.

 

 Agree with everything. A lot of the "Tradition" teams are wandering around now, seeking the Coach who will return them to glory. As a rule they didn't like Oregon when Chip's run started, "Flashy, Finesse,"  were the calls against the new kid in town. 

 

Oregon went through a downturn, but has come back, at least farther back than Nebraska, FSU, Texas, USC. But yet, there's trouble. The last thing we want is for Mario to feel alienated by the fans. But we see what we see, and being loyal doesn't mean shut up and clap. Mario wants to win a championship. So do we.  

[Haywarduck]

On 10/18/2021 at 9:59 AM, Jon Joseph said:

Nebraska academics? Nebraska was an AAU member school when it joined the B1G. No longer the case. Only B1G school that is not an AAU member.

 

I was at a game in Lincoln where CU, ultimately beat down by the Ducks in the bowl game, destroyed a Nebraska team that played Miami for the BCS title. I assure you that on that day many the boo was heard from the Cornhusker fans. 

 

Pelini was often booed. Booed out of Lincoln. Frost is the fair haired child but he also is starting to hear it.

 

Nebraska fired a 9+ win a season Frank Solich and has never been the same since. Solich did excellent work in the MAC at Ohio. 

 

Nebraska's AD and HC hires have been on par with those of USC; lousy.

The quote was back when Solich was coach. I would argue the Nebraska fanbase is a perfect example of what we don't want Oregon to become, and is on the verge of becoming.

 

I will also say it is the model of what a program should have been, until they took that turn of creating the turnstile of coaches so many programs have created.  Oregon can be the Nebraska that stood by Solich, or the program that decided to fire him and go decades looking for the next great coach while creating such a toxic environment that even when they find the guy he can't win.

 

Again I have no problem criticizing, questioning coaches decisions. I don't even have a problem question student athlete's, I certainly didn't support AB last spring or this fall. I will say I have come around to accepting this team and all it's worts. The process may not be pretty, but we don't want to become a worse picture of that process as a fanbase.

[Charles Fischer]

Everybody Please Note:

 

I was not at the game Saturday night; my seats were filled by someone else and I have no idea if they booed.

 

But I agree with the sentiments of those who boo, and the helplessness we feel watching our brand die.

 

Considering what Cristobal has done to the offense?  He deserves to be booed...

[Charles Fischer]

On 10/18/2021 at 9:46 AM, Haywarduck said:

I also don't want to become another football program always on the lookout for the next great coach with a quick fix.

 

Nowhere in my article did I ask for the coach to be fired, you are assuming that direction and it does NOT represent my views.  I want him to stay, but turn the offense over to the OC.  We are booing the offense that Cristobal has chosen.

[Charles Fischer]

On 10/18/2021 at 9:46 AM, Haywarduck said:

I don't want to become an ugly fanbase.

 

We don't want to be.   You stressed patience with the coach, but if he had an offensive system....he would have put it in place in year one and year two....and we would be reaping the benefits in year 3.5 (now) and there would be no complaint.

 

You assume he will learn and change, and my point in the article is that the majority of people were in that mode for the first three years and were "hopeful" coming into this season.  The Ohio State game gave us hope of change, and now we are back to the "Prevent-Offense."

 

The majority of fans have realized that he is not going to change, and the appearance of booing is something we would rather live with than watching this offense decline further.

 

Yes...he wants to win a championship, but can you honestly say that his offense will do it?  

[Charles Fischer]

On 10/18/2021 at 10:00 AM, Haywarduck said:

Like I said, it is the big boys who really are going to hit the AD in the pocket. My point is if you want to protest, don't buy the garb, the food, walk out.

 

And like I said...easy for you to say.  I do not want to lose my 35 year priority status, and thus am trapped.  I do not know the big-boys, and suggesting that I rally them sounds good on a message board, but is impractical in real-life.

 

Haywarduck...we are friends, but we are going to disagree on this one and that is fine.  In my view--you are more concerned with our appearance as fans than you are with the results on the field.  Something has to give to get the results we want, and booing will do more to generate change than any of the suggestions you have offered--in my opinion.

 

Why is this so important?  Because that offense is NOT going to take us to the promised land, and a critical mass of fans have realized it.

 

Good discussion to flush out all these points for people to ponder...

Don't these people who pay thousands to attend deserve better than winning on the last play to the 11th team in the conference?

[Jon Joseph]

Coaches are hired for 2 reasons. To recruit and to win big games.

 

Mario has aced the 1st requirement. But the 2nd?

 

Every game left on the 2021 Oregon schedule is a 'big game playoff-wise.' As of today, Oregon is favored in every one of the remaining regular season games.

 

In 2019, Mario dropped a PO critical game to a mediocre ASU team.

 

His big critical game win, if you consider the Rose Bowl when a non-semifinal PO site as a critical game, a 1 point win over 3L Wisconsin.

 

In 2020 he was out-coached by Wilcox, Smith and the entire Iowa State coaching staff.

 

As Charles points out, at this point in time no one should be calling for Mario to be fired. 

 

But if he can recruit and cannot win the critcal games he is the next Ed Orgeron and rightfully so.

 

 

[1Ducker1]

I dont think there would be much booing if we were the same type of team we were 25-30 yrs ago. We would be happy with the wins anyway we could get them. 

But times have changed, the $$$ thrown onto the program the facilities AND the coaches has changed---People expect more when more has been put into the program. We now have a $ 4 mil a year coach and a whole bunch of 4* players, facilities that are even better than a lot of NFL teams. I expect better than how we played against Stony Brook, Stanford, Zona and especially Cal at home after a 2 week bye.

[DuckFan93]

The fan frustration was entirely justified.   Every time they booed, I was booing at home at the TV too...

 

The biggest problem with Mario is his refusal to change and adjust.   So I hope it's correctly reported that the boos really bothered him.  Now we will see which team shows up this Saturday, when they get to play without worrying about the fans booing - the Q3 team or the Q4 team of the last game...

[shawnski]

It's not difficult and it's not an all or nothing game. 

Could have and SHOULD have played Thompson for a series or two in the 3rd Quarter. SHOULD have run Cardwell once or twice instead of only at the end, twice.

 

Just show some signs of change/improvement is all we're asking.

 

Nope, he refuses 

[DimpleDucks]

Great article, Charles, and I agree.

 

I don't know if players are really much affected by boos and I think they know it's mostly directed to the coaching staff. These are tough kids, even if a bit pampered in some cases. If a coach sees booing as disloyal then maybe he's too soft to do his job.

 

If you're tough enough to play college ball, you should be tough enough to hear some boos. What I don't like is when a coach is interviewed and asked about the boos, he doesn't own it and deflects it to the players and says something like..."gee, I don't know why the fans are booing". 

 

Also, my opinion, booing doesn't make for 'an ugly fan base' but indicates the football intelligence level of fans. 

[Annie]

On 10/18/2021 at 10:41 AM, 1Ducker1 said:

....especially Cal at home after a 2 week bye.

Not that it changes much, but I believe Cal had a 2-week bye also.

[Charles Fischer]

On 10/18/2021 at 10:36 AM, Charles Fischer said:

In my view--you are more concerned with our appearance as fans than you are with the results on the field. 

 

Haywarduck...I apologize for that.  I got carried away, as I know you care very deeply about the program or you would not be in this forum as you are.  You care about the results on the field, but we disagree on how to nudge Cristobal into improving.

[DuckFan93]

Apparently the gamblers agree with the pollsters too - the line for UCLA opened as -3 for dux, then instantly shifted to +1.5.... LOL.  They are tired of getting their butt kicked, booing or not...

[Charles Fischer]

I do admire the players for being mentally tough and using the boos to inspire them.  Not what I would want, as I want those boos directed at Cristobal...

[Haywarduck]

 I am an admitted idealist who tries to be a realist. I completely agree times have changed with expectations, and what is acceptable. 

 

In the past our program accepted the losses and struggles while looking longterm. I question whether we have that same patience and ability to really understand the process it took, nor the process it may take. 

 

There are two choices, be patient like few programs in this day and age, or get in line for the musical chairs of coaches.

 

Some of you may be right, it will take negative fan pressure to change Cristobal. I think we may just run him off like so many other programs do to their coaches. For most respect and loyalty is a two way street, Cristobal I bet falls into this camp.

 

I am also not saying this is the outward request of many of your expectations and actions. The question will be is this the longterm affect on the program, just another program in which there is a toxic fanbase, along with an Athletic Department trying to appease the lowest denominator.  It is a nationwide pandemic on most fandom.

 

Oh how I love to agree to disagree, fills me up.

[Haywarduck]

On 10/18/2021 at 11:11 AM, Charles Fischer said:

 

Haywarduck...I apologize for that.  I got carried away, as I know you care very deeply about the program or you would not be in this forum as you are.  You care about the results on the field, but we disagree on how to nudge Cristobal into improving.

Agree that isn't my concern, actually the exact opposite. I disagree with how to nudge the program, and agree to disagree.

 

I do think there is a plethora of evidence on how we don't want to go down the road I see happening with our fanbase. I also enjoy when discussion creates passionate discussion!

[Jon Joseph]

Hayward, really respect your POV.

 

Where is Mario going to run to? Where is he going to go to earn, with endorsement income, @$5M a year? What CFB program today is willing to pay a $9M buy out to acquire Mario's services?

 

If Mario does not get the reason for the fan unrest, that's on Mario. As others have pointed out, Mario represented to carry on with an exciting brand of Ducks football. Based on what we have seen on the field that was a misrepresentation; actually, a gross misrepresentation.

 

The man is as stubborn as a mule and determined come hell or high water to play O in a phone booth. How will this philosophy of offense lead to a national championship in this day and age of CFB?

 

Mario is fortunate that he is not competing in the B1G or the SEC. And I can't see Oregon being able to score enough points to possibly outscore Oklahoma?

 

The Pac-10 was a better, deeper league back when Pete Carroll was turning excellent recruiting into national titles. 

 

Perhaps the fans who were booing have higher expectations than what they see on the field? They see self inflicted wounds and clock mismanagement cost the Stanford game. They see Oregon struggle against an awful Arizona and a now 1-5 CAL. Struggle against a Mountain West opponent. Struggle against a little league opponent. And win at the home of the AP #5 team in the nation with the Ducks best player on the bench. THIS is a big time disconnect for most folks.

 

Sorry, but when any team wins in Columbus its fans do not expect it to play down game after game to the level of inferior competition. We have this under Mario more often than not in the last 2 seasons. Seasons when he didn't have the NFL rookie of the year at QB.

 

It's simple. The time has come to judge Mario strictly on Ws and Ls, because stellar recruiting that doesn't translate into wins and dominant wins against lesser opponents is a waste of talent.

 

Mario has the talent on this roster to run the table in a conference where Oregon is the only top 25 ranked team. Will he do so? I hope so, I really do. But to do so he is going to have to get out of his own way. 

[DanLduck]

I've never been a fan of booing kids in sports, non-professionals if you will. But the NIL has changed that for me.

Players want to be paid, then they should suffer consequences when they perform poorly. 

Players are no longer simply "student athletes". They now get paid.

 

This is the 4th year with Cristobal. I think the fan base has been patient. Watching prevent offense is, well, offensive. We demand more.

 

As far as voting with your wallets goes, that is a slow process. A few timely boos can be more effective. 

[Steven A]

Booing when appropriate is not disloyalty.   You paid your money (and I agree with Charles about not being able to vote with your pocketbook without cutting off your nose) and it is your choice.  

 

Reminding the team their poop stinks is not a bad thing.  Just think about that emperor who tried on his new clothes because no one had the guts to tell him the truth. 

[Charles Fischer]

On 10/18/2021 at 12:38 PM, DanLduck said:

This is the 4th year with Cristobal. I think the fan base has been patient. Watching prevent offense is, well, offensive. We demand more.

 

A powerful set of statements and true.  The fan base has been patient, and 3.5 years is long enough to see progress on offense.  What we see on offense is entirely due to decisions Coach Cristobal has made.

 

On defense?  I think most of us recognize all the injuries and youth on that side of the ball.

[Haywarduck]

I agree, what is being seen on the field isn't acceptable to a fan base which has seen qb after qb who is a superstar, but that isn't what we have now. I also agree seeing an offense, which seems to be a prevent offense is at best confusing to a fanbase who watched hurry up become a thing. The offense is evolving, and maybe enough going forward, we will see.

 

What I don't agree is booing is a part of the answer. The answer will either come from Cristobal evolving, having a respectful discussion with say a Saban, or the quiet hand which has guided so many programs in the Athletic Department. What booing and an unruly fanbase will do is create a toxic place to work, and play for the student athletes along with the coaches to grow into what we all want. Again I will agree to disagree with how to get that done.

 

I think we can all agree the next 6-7 weeks will go a long way to solidifying our positions on what is going on. I also think we want that to end on a positive note, that we can all agree upon, I hope!

[DanLduck]

I've never been a fan of booing, especially students. But now with NIL that has all changed. 

These guys now get paid to play. They are no longer simply "student athletes".

 

So if they perform poorly, they deserve to be booed. I'm tired of "soft" kids. If a few boos hurt their feelings, how can they play tough.

 

One complaint, Walk said the booing inspired the O-line to play harder, why do they need that type of motivation?

Do these blue chip, D1 players need coddling? C'mon man.

[Southwest Duck]

I think as a fan base we are spoiled.

 

If being patient is a Rose Bowl win, back to back pac-12 titles, and starting out 5-1 this season with a win over Ohio St.

 

Sign me up every time! 
 

I share my fellow duck fans disappointment with the qb play and offense, but there are so many worse situations this program could be in.

 

Coach Mario works his tail off on the recruiting trail and has created a great culture, I would be sad if he left.

 

Just be a little more patient duck fans, if Mario stays, I firmly believe, we will be in the playoffs with a chance to win the whole thing in the next 2-3 seasons!

 

Heck, I know it’s a long shot with the way they’re playing,  but the Ducks still have a shot this year!!

 

Boo if you want, but I’ll be cheering them on!!

[Georgia Duck]

I'm a long time Duck fan that has seen aa ton of football in 70+ years of watching this great game.  I too am frustrated by a number of the deficiencies noted by others, but am a long way from booing to try and get my way.  I know our society has assumed that we can have it all and have it all now, especially if we paid for our seat at the stadium.  On the offensive side of the ball I can point to one glaring deficiency that will not allow the Ducks to run up the touchdowns as we had in years past. 

 

Anthony Brown is a wonderful young man, a good leader and has a ton of courage on the football field.  However, he lacks skill in key areas that will never allow the Ducks to really run up a score.  He is not accurate first of all.  He is a career 55% passer in a world of 65%+ passers.  He is even less accurate the farther down the field he throws the ball.  He does not appear to have great vision in surveying the field to find an open receiver, and he frequently stares down a receiver. 

 

So with those flaws, why not replace him with TT?  I know the coaches know if TT is ready or not.  The few times he has been in this year have not convinced me he is ready.  The rest of this year and spring football may get him to that point.  In a world where the QB is more important than ever, not having the best QB on the field is a real liability.  If you look at all our games, how many will we have the better skilled QB on the field?  I can only think of 2 or 3 - Stony Brook, Arizona, and maybe Colorado. 

 

Add to that the penchant for untimely penalties and we are in for a lot of close games (that is a coaching problem).  One needs to look at a couple of other factors.  One we are playing with a very young roster.  UCLA has been losing for years because they were young, just waiting till Chip's guys were seasoned.  He is winning this year because of the transfer portal and he has a veteran team.  Mario has done a lot with young players and if TT develops like we think he can,  the next couple of years should be grand. 

 

As to the person that said he doesn't win big games,  the OSU win was one of the biggest wins of this season.  We are fortunate to living in a world of first world problems compared to 75% of college football teams.  Have a latte with your avocado toast and relax.

[HappyToBeADuck]

So many outstanding and passionate thoughts on this "one of a kind site". I agree that a paying customer has every right to voice their displeasure.  Booing is a part of the entertainment business! Doesn't make the situation any less painful to watch.

 

I have 3 thoughts that keep swimming thru my brain.

 

First: Wonder what the potential recruits felt, as they heard the boos? Many a Duck recruit has been sold by the loud, supportive crowd at Autzen. The most recent commit mentioned that he was influenced by the fan support at the Stony Brook game. He's not the first to mention the crowd and atmosphere influenced their decision to join the duck family.

 

Second. The comments about how fast a power house program can disappear right before your eyes. (USC, FSU, Nebraska, the peewee team up north, for example. 

 

Oregon is not immune from downturns.

1998-2001. 38-10

2002-2004  20-17

2005-2014. 106-26

2015-2017 20-18

2018-YTD  30-10

 

My hat is off to the AD'S and coaches who made the necessary changes and adjustments of the last 25 years. We are not in the scrap heap of has been programs because of that. And we are not headed their now. (Blinders in full effect)

 

Third: When the 2 deeps are announced for the UCLA game. Look at the true freshman,  covid freshman,  redshirt freshman and sophomores on that list. Add in the injuries and our results are pretty solid. We may fall flat and end up 6-6. We may end up 11-2 and headed to Rose Bowl. These coaches are teaching 18 year olds to compete with 5th and 6th year players. I love this painful journey as we watch boys grow to be men.

 

Go Ducks and thank you to all for what you bring to this safe site.

[Charles Fischer]

On 10/18/2021 at 1:56 PM, HappyToBeADuck said:

Go Ducks and thank you to all for what you bring to this safe site.

 

There are so many that post here that I certainly disagree with, but it is fun to trade thoughts without the attacks that happen elsewhere.  Thank YOU for noting it, and please do post your thoughts often.

 

Even if I disagree...no, better yet, ESPECIALLY if I disagree, as I need to see them.  All those that disagree with me?  Reading their thoughts helps me to buffer and moderate mine, and thus become a better fan.  It is a virtuous discussion-circle and I sure enjoy it.  Thanks again...

[Triphibius]

I was not at the game. I viewed with the sound muted from the eastern time zone, where I was increasingly blearly-eyed as the game continued. Admittedly, I do not know the full context. In general, I believe Oregon fans ought not to boo anyone in Green and Yellow (or black, silver, mauve, off-white, whatever). These are my reasons. 

 

1. The players are still primarily amateur athletes, who must attend college classes. NIL is not going to increase Ryan Walk's net worth, nor that of the vast majority of players. Amateur athletes ought not to booed unless they are guilty of a conspicuous lack of effort or poor sportsmanship. Anthony Brown is by all accounts a good young man who competes hard, accepts responsibility when he performs poorly, and enjoys the respect of his teammates. He deserves better, even when he does not play as well as we would like. 

 

2. Perhaps the boos are not directed at him but the coaches, but how are the players to know? The boos are a blunt instrument, and seem as likely to demoralize the players as inspire them, and possibly to disgust prospective players. (Side note: yet another top flight recruit joined the fold over the weekend.) 

 

3. Many here are frustrated by the lack of any downfield passing threat, which seems likely to cost the Ducks one or more games going forward this year. (Of course we don't see the  QBs in practice, and I don't know the fine points of quarterback play, but I know what I saw from Butterfield during the spring game.) Certainly, Coach Cristobal's decision to stick with QB Brown can be questioned, but have we reached the point at which we want the coach gone? Is that the message fans want to send? Do fans think U of O football would be better off if for example Cristobal were to take the LSU job? I side with Hayward on this. Be careful what you wish for. 

 

4. I was told by a Florida fan that they would never accept Will Muschamp because they not only wanted to win, they wanted to win in style. I see a parallel with our own situation. The undertone here is one of deep nostalgia for the Chip Kelly years. Chip is not walking back back through the door, however. I mean this literally and figuratively. Literally, if he wanted to come back, and I am not sure I would want him, with all his faults. Figuratively, opposing coaches have had years to scheme against the spread, to recruit personnel to defend it, and to train their athletes to compete against it. It is probably not possible to win in the manner we did at the heighth of the Kelly years, regardless who is coach. Our current running game is fairly healthy. Personally, I love watching Travis Dye run, and the coaches and linemen are creating good opportunities for him. If Cristobal and Moorhead could couple that with an effective downfield passing attack, the offensive would both highly effective and entertaining to watch. I still think this will happen when (not if) Thompson or Butterfield takes over at quarterback, whether this year or more likely next. 

[C J]

Wow, some great back and forth and words of wisdom on this one.

 

It's a really tough situation right? I don't know a single Duck fan who is ecstatic about the program right now. I know some who are MC backers basically resigned to what is happening, but they still aren't really pleased. 

 

We are kind of sitting on this precipice, unsure of what to do, but we know what our eyeballs are telling us and we don't like it. Eventually people have to have a way to let the coach know that they know he is blowing it on a few fronts. The only way I can see to do that is by voicing an opinion during the game in real time when the mistakes are being made = BOOOOOOOO!!!! And so that is what happened Friday night........for better or for worse. 

 

Personally I wish it would never happen and that there was never a reason for it to happen, but I do think it has been earned at this point. This isn't a situation where there is one or two or even three poor offensive performances. This is a situation where there has literally been dozens of poor offensive performances over the past 3.5 years.

 

Will it lead to a toxic relationship between fans and the organization? Probably not, but there is potential for that. I do get the feeling that Cristobal will certainly take exception to the booing. I think we have all come to the conclusion that he is incredibly loyal....almost to a fault. If he perceives the booing as a breach of loyalty (and my guess is he will or already has) then this could lead to a toxic and antagonistic relationship until his departure.

[GODUCKS15]

The same fans who booed AB's crappy passes were the same ones cheering when he ran in for a TD. Too many IPA's? Maybe. Or do they feel just arrogant enough to think they know more than the coaches?

I was in the stands in row 43 sec 12 and I guaranty the players and coaches heard the boo's followed by the "Put in TY" yells going on around me. So they knew what the boo's were for.

 

I'm not a big fan of booing at players. From what I saw most played their guts out. AB's in the game trying his hardest because MC wants him there. It's not fair to him to hear the TY chants. He's just doing what he's asked to do with the best of his ability.  

 

This is all on the coaches and all displeasure should be directed at the coaches. 

I doubt if booing will make a difference in the long run. Low attendance at games will.

[Jon Joseph]

On 10/18/2021 at 6:02 PM, Triphibius said:

I was not at the game. I viewed with the sound muted from the eastern time zone, where I was increasingly blearly-eyed as the game continued. Admittedly, I do not know the full context. In general, I believe Oregon fans ought not to boo anyone in Green and Yellow (or black, silver, mauve, off-white, whatever). These are my reasons. 

 

1. The players are still primarily amateur athletes, who must attend college classes. NIL is not going to increase Ryan Walk's net worth, nor that of the vast majority of players. Amateur athletes ought not to booed unless they are guilty of a conspicuous lack of effort or poor sportsmanship. Anthony Brown is by all accounts a good young man who competes hard, accepts responsibility when he performs poorly, and enjoys the respect of his teammates. He deserves better, even when he does not play as well as we would like. 

 

2. Perhaps the boos are not directed at him but the coaches, but how are the players to know? The boos are a blunt instrument, and seem as likely to demoralize the players as inspire them, and possibly to disgust prospective players. (Side note: yet another top flight recruit joined the fold over the weekend.) 

 

3. Many here are frustrated by the lack of any downfield passing threat, which seems likely to cost the Ducks one or more games going forward this year. (Of course we don't see the  QBs in practice, and I don't know the fine points of quarterback play, but I know what I saw from Butterfield during the spring game.) Certainly, Coach Cristobal's decision to stick with QB Brown can be questioned, but have we reached the point at which we want the coach gone? Is that the message fans want to send? Do fans think U of O football would be better off if for example Cristobal were to take the LSU job? I side with Hayward on this. Be careful what you wish for. 

 

4. I was told by a Florida fan that they would never accept Will Muschamp because they not only wanted to win, they wanted to win in style. I see a parallel with our own situation. The undertone here is one of deep nostalgia for the Chip Kelly years. Chip is not walking back back through the door, however. I mean this literally and figuratively. Literally, if he wanted to come back, and I am not sure I would want him, with all his faults. Figuratively, opposing coaches have had years to scheme against the spread, to recruit personnel to defend it, and to train their athletes to compete against it. It is probably not possible to win in the manner we did at the heighth of the Kelly years, regardless who is coach. Our current running game is fairly healthy. Personally, I love watching Travis Dye run, and the coaches and linemen are creating good opportunities for him. If Cristobal and Moorhead could couple that with an effective downfield passing attack, the offensive would both highly effective and entertaining to watch. I still think this will happen when (not if) Thompson or Butterfield takes over at quarterback, whether this year or more likely next. 

 

Great post. Mullens was lit up by Matt Hayes today on the Saturday Down South site. Hayes wonders why Coach O is gone yet Mullens, not as good a recruiter than O, is not in the same position as Coach O whose LSU team just hung 49 points on UF.

 

BTW - Utah plays at UF in the opener in 2022 and UF comes to SLC the year after.